Author Topic: Leicestershire Assizes - Convict records  (Read 1855 times)

Offline sharonkai

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Leicestershire Assizes - Convict records
« on: Tuesday 06 September 16 10:14 BST (UK) »
Can anyone tell me if the Leicestershire Assizes records for 1832 be accessed on-line or if it is possible to get a copy of a record?

I want to check a record for a convict - he was found guilty and sentenced to a Life sentence, and transported to Australia - arrived 1833.

I'd like to see what the offence was that he was charged with, and any other information that may have been on the document.

Regards
Sharon.

Offline majm

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Re: Leicestershire Assizes - Convict records
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 06 September 16 10:35 BST (UK) »
Hi there,

Welcome to RootsChat.

You may well find that the offence is recorded on official records in the archives in the colony ... 1833 ... life .... so transported to New South Wales or Van Diemen's Land ?

If you post on the Australia Board, I am sure there will be RChatters able to help you there if the Leichestershire Assizes records are not readily available. 

If you have the convict's name and ship of arrival I am happy to help with a look through my own NSW resources ....

JM
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Offline cath151

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Re: Leicestershire Assizes - Convict records
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 06 September 16 10:41 BST (UK) »
Hi
Is it John Moore you are looking for?
There is apiece in the Leicester Journal 30 March 1832 for a "John Moore aged 25 who stole 2 cows property of Thomas Hatton of Whitwick" he was sentenced to execution.
Thankfully he seems to have been reprieved
Northampton Mercury 14 thApril 1832
"A reprieve arrived on Wednesday last for John Moore condemned at the late Leicester assizes for stealing cattle- he will be transported for life."
Cathy
Sinnock/Sinnicks...Brighton,Greenwich.
Clements,Coles,Mc Donagh,Rock

Census InformationCrown Copyright from www.national archives.gov.uk

Offline majm

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Re: Leicestershire Assizes - Convict records
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 06 September 16 10:49 BST (UK) »
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=755290.msg6047821#msg6047821

I have just posted on Sharon's other thread.  :)   I think we are all 'on track'

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
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Offline sharonkai

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Re: Leicestershire Assizes - Convict records
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 06 September 16 10:55 BST (UK) »
Thanks so much JM.

The convict was John Moore, convicted in Leicestershire, who arrived in Sydney on the Mangles (voyage 6 for this ship) in 1833.  On the shipping record it says he was a convict and was sent to the Mulgoa area - when he got his ticket of leave, it was on the condition that he remain in the Mudgee area. 

I'm trying to find out if he ended up going to Camden.  We've looked at him on the vessel information on Ancestry but it just says he was sentenced to Life.  I have an ancestor with the same name and am trying to work out if he went to the Camden area and worked for an employer who employed convictds.  My ancestor was murdered in 1859 and there is very little information other than he was born in Prested, Leicestershire - Leicestershire is where the convict was sentenced.

Regards
Sharon


Offline majm

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Re: Leicestershire Assizes - Convict records
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 06 September 16 11:01 BST (UK) »
Ancestry does not have all the Convict records.  Ancestry has a partnership arrangement with the NSW State Records.  NSW State Records have allowed Ancestry to digitise and upload 'SOME' of the records.  FindMyPast also has similar partnership arrangement with NSW State Records.   There are other resources that are not available via Ancestry or FindMyPast. 

Many of the other resources are listed at RChat's NSW resources board.  .... Each of the main boards at RChat include resources board to help us all out.

Here's the live link to RChat's NSW resources.   
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=369703.0   

By the way, I am assuming that the Camden you write of is the one in NSW.   :)    I will see what I have in my offline NSW resources. 

Cheers,  JM
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Offline majm

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Re: Leicestershire Assizes - Convict records
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 07 September 16 04:10 BST (UK) »
I have some thoughts to share.

http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/13032865  SMH 8 Nov 1859
£50 reward offered for Thomas PECKHAM, in respect of the murder of John MOORE, 4 October near Camden.

NSW BDM online index has that 4 Oct 1859 death for John MOORE, with his parents given names as John and Mary.   

NSW State Records do not have the Inquest reports for that era, only the index.   The files are likely no longer extant.  I have not searched trove for any reports of the inquest.   But may I mention that "native" in that era refers to a person born in New South Wales, and so the Thomas Peckham who is named in that Nov 1859 cutting is someone born in NSW whose complexion is dark .... so perhaps someone who had spent most of his life working outdoors. 

John MOORE married Susan CATERSON in January 1856.  The NSW BDM commenced civil registrations in March 1856, so may I comment that the NSW BDM record of that January 1856 marriage may be scant on information, but hopefully the original parish register (St Johns Roman Catholic church, Campbelltown NSW) may contain further information that John gave the clergy about himself.  (… perhaps some or all of the following clues:  age, place of birth, ship of arrival, occupation, father’s name/occupation).   As divorce did not come to NSW until 1873, that 1856 marriage record would give John’s status either as widow/er or as bachelor.    He was not a young man when he married Susan, was there an earlier marriage perhaps. 

May I ask if you have searched for the original register of that marriage, to see all the information that may have been recorded there.   ….. not the summary information that NSW BDM may hold …. I am hoping the clergyman was aware of the requirements that were to commence from 1 March 1856 and may have asked John MOORE for all those, or alternatively may have asked for and recorded the name of his ship of arrival ….. 

Otherwise, I cannot actually see how you can join the dots back to the chap on the Mangles over twenty years earlier.  There’s many chaps in NSW in the 1850s clearly named John MOORE, probably many of them arrived in the early 1850s chasing their fortunes …. Gold Rushes come to mind. 

Here’s the index sightings:

NSW BDM online index http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/Pages/family-history/family-history.aspx

Birth registered Camden district in 1860 for Mary, with parents as John and Susan MOORE
#5931
 
Death registered Camden district in 1859 for John, with parents as John and Mary MOORE #2820

Early Church Records Marriage in 1856 “LE” (St Johns Roman Catholic church, Campbelltown NSW) John MOORE and Susan CATERSON
# Volume 101, line 731 

Familysearch.org
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTZJ-C8K  Susan Caterson marriage 7 Jan 1856.

So, I am concerned that there could be confusion between the various John MOORE chaps in NSW in the 1850s, basically because not all official records have survived, and civil registrations of BDM events did not commence until 1 March 1856.   


JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
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Offline majm

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Re: Leicestershire Assizes - Convict records
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 07 September 16 04:13 BST (UK) »
Re Inquests Index only  (John Moore death 4 Oct 1859(

"Inquests 1826-1963

Indexes / Registers
Where only indexes survive
For some years, for example, May 1859-Mar 1864 indexes are the only surviving records relating to inquests. For further information about an inquest in this period you will need to check newspapers
.

https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/archives/collections-and-research/guides-and-indexes/inquests-coronial-records-guide

The information on the NSW death certificate .... it should include the details supplied by the informant including "how long in the colonies" .... who was the informant, and what answer was given to the question regarding time in the colonies...

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Offline sharonkai

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Re: Leicestershire Assizes - Convict records
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 07 September 16 07:28 BST (UK) »
Dear JM

Thanks so much for your reply - I appreciate all the help and information you've given me.

My husband's had previously found the report about John Moore being murdered at Camden.  We had the report of the murder but haven't looked for the inquest as you suggested, but will now see if we can get it.

We also found a report 2 years after the murder where, during another court case, a man was thought to be Peckham.  The court then sent to Camden for the police, who knew Peckham, to be brought to Parramatta to identify him. When the policeman, that knew Peckham, saw the accused he immediately said it wasn't him.  We haven't found any further information for the murder and can only assume that Peckham was never gaoled for the murder, unfortunately.

John Moore and Susannah Moore (nee Caterson) had two children after civil registration came in.  We can find no registration for either of the children - James and Alice.  When John was murdered, Susannah was pregnant with their third child.  Their daughter, Mary, was born a couple of months after John's death.

We've looked everywhere for John's birth/arrival in Australia, without success.  John was about 40 when he married Susannah, who was about 20. (Someone else has a tree on Ancestry with a different John Moore (convict from Lancashire) married to Susannah (nee Caterson) on their family tree but we don't believe this is correct.)  We've checked what immigration records are available and can find no entry for a John Moore - that's the reason why we were looking on the convict records.  On 'our' John Moore's death certificate it has him as being born in Prested, Leicestershire AND the same information is also on his daughter Mary's birth certificate, who was born after his death. Susannah couldn't read or write and was Irish, so perhaps her accent when she advised of John's birthplace, played a part in the person recording the information to record the wrong information???

We do know where John and Susannah were employed, in the Camden area, so we plan on contacting the Camden Library to see if they can be of any further help.  we're hoping that there may be some records that were kept of the names of people employed on farms/estates in this area.

Once again, thanks for all the information and help you've given me - I appreciate it very much.

Warm regards
Sharon