Author Topic: owen pugh born Llannarth~1811,baptised 23 december 1812 Llanllwchaiarn  (Read 514 times)

Offline ivorglyn

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owen pugh born Llannarth~1811,baptised 23 december 1812 Llanllwchaiarn
« on: Saturday 10 September 16 19:47 BST (UK) »
Dear all,I found this information on familysearch.Owen Pugh b.~1811 Llannarth Cardiganshire and christened 23 /dec/1812 in Llanllwchaiarn.I can't find the birth or the baptism on findmypast.I was wondering whether anyone has such records.I searched for births/baptisms on findmypast in Wales between 1809 and 1813 and the only records for an Owen Pugh were:Owen Parry Pugh 9/oct/1809 in Montgomery mother Elizabeth and Owen Pugh b.Dolgellau Merionethshire (9/dec/1909) with parents Hugh and Gwen.The Owen Pugh I am looking for died between 1871 and 1881 in Brecon and was down as b.1810(not 1811).Owen married Elizabeth Walters in Llandingat on 21/oct/1834.On the 1851W census the family live at Llandingat(d) in Green Lodge Llandovery.Owen is down as a wheelwright b.Cardiganshire.Elizabeth died in late 1861 but is down ot the 1861 census.The family live at Mount Pleasant,St Johns,Brecknock.Owen Pugh married Mary Ann Prosser in Brecknock in 1862(4).I would be grateful if anyone knows possible parents for Owen?..kind regards ivorglyn

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Offline osprey

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Re: owen pugh born Llannarth~1811,baptised 23 december 1812 Llanllwchaiarn
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 11 September 16 10:24 BST (UK) »
do you have a copy of his marriage cert which should give name and occupation for his father?
His death was registered aged 66 dec qtr 1876 Brecknock vol 11b pg 70 & marriage dec qtr 1862 Brecknock vol 11b pg 267

He is consistent in giving Llannarth as his place of birth. There is this baptism from 2 April 1809 which has been indexed as a patronymic

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X1BN-JBK

Other children baptised to the same couple
John bp 28 April 1816 at Trefilan
Ann bp 21 Oct 1813 at Llandysul
George bp 27 Feb 1820 at Llanfihangel Ystrad

Possible burial for Grace aged 40 25 Dec 1819 at Llanfihangel Ystrad
These 4 all on FreeReg
Cornwall: Allen, Bevan, Bosisto, Carnpezzack, Donithorn, Huddy, James, Retallack, Russell, Vincent, Yeoman
Cards: Thomas (Llanbadarn Fawr)
Glam: Bowler, Cram, Galloway, James, Thomas, Watkins
Lincs: Coupland, Cram
Mon: Cram, Gwyn, John, Philpot, Smart, Watkins
Pembs: Edwards (St. Dogmael's)
Yorks: Airey, Bowler, Elliott, Hare, Hewitt, Kellett, Kemp, Stephenson, Tebb

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Offline ivorglyn

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Re: owen pugh born Llannarth~1811,baptised 23 december 1812 Llanllwchaiarn
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 11 September 16 13:49 BST (UK) »
Dear Osprey,Thankyou for that.I am now trying to find out the surname of Grace.I'll try looking on dustydocs,freereg and findmypast and familysearch,and IGI..kindregards ivorglyn

Offline osprey

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Re: owen pugh born Llannarth~1811,baptised 23 december 1812 Llanllwchaiarn
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 11 September 16 15:49 BST (UK) »
another baptism to the couple in Llanfihangel Ystrad

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X1T9-165
Cornwall: Allen, Bevan, Bosisto, Carnpezzack, Donithorn, Huddy, James, Retallack, Russell, Vincent, Yeoman
Cards: Thomas (Llanbadarn Fawr)
Glam: Bowler, Cram, Galloway, James, Thomas, Watkins
Lincs: Coupland, Cram
Mon: Cram, Gwyn, John, Philpot, Smart, Watkins
Pembs: Edwards (St. Dogmael's)
Yorks: Airey, Bowler, Elliott, Hare, Hewitt, Kellett, Kemp, Stephenson, Tebb

Offline ivorglyn

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Re: owen pugh born Llannarth~1811,baptised 23 december 1812 Llanllwchaiarn
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 11 September 16 17:46 BST (UK) »
Dear Osprey,Yes I had that one.Once again thankyou.Re the death of Grace in 1819..one of the children George is down as birth/baptism 27/feb/1820 in Llanfihangel-Ystrad.I can't find a marriage for a James Pugh and a Grace in Cardiganshire..kind regards ivorglyn

Offline osprey

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Re: owen pugh born Llannarth~1811,baptised 23 december 1812 Llanllwchaiarn
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 11 September 16 18:19 BST (UK) »
there's only 2 months between the burial of Grace & baptism of George, so I would think Grace died in childbirth. Baptism gives Grace as mother.

There's not a lot of Cardiganshire marriages from before 1813 online, the registers are at the NLW in Aberystwyth and the archives have copies on microfilm as well.

http://www.archifdy-ceredigion.org.uk/
Cornwall: Allen, Bevan, Bosisto, Carnpezzack, Donithorn, Huddy, James, Retallack, Russell, Vincent, Yeoman
Cards: Thomas (Llanbadarn Fawr)
Glam: Bowler, Cram, Galloway, James, Thomas, Watkins
Lincs: Coupland, Cram
Mon: Cram, Gwyn, John, Philpot, Smart, Watkins
Pembs: Edwards (St. Dogmael's)
Yorks: Airey, Bowler, Elliott, Hare, Hewitt, Kellett, Kemp, Stephenson, Tebb

Offline ivorglyn

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Re: owen pugh born Llannarth~1811,baptised 23 december 1812 Llanllwchaiarn
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 14 September 16 16:03 BST (UK) »
Dear Osprey et al,I found a James Pugh on the 1851W census living at New Well,Llangam(m)arch,Breconshire down as a wheelwright b.Llanarth Cardiganshire.Owen( James) Pugh b.~1809 was also a wheelwright.James Pugh's wife in 1851 was Mary(aged 55) b. Llanfair ar y Bryn and there was a daughter Mary aged 21 and a son John aged 13.There was a marriage in 1829(30/may) in Llanfair ar y Bryn between James Pugh and Mary Rees.James Pugh is down on the 1851 census as aged 63(b.~1788).I would be grateful if anyone recognises this information and can perhaps shed more light on James Pugh's initial marriage with Grace(probably between 1803-1809 in Llanarth?)..kind regards to all ivorglyn.

Offline osprey

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Re: owen pugh born Llannarth~1811,baptised 23 december 1812 Llanllwchaiarn
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 14 September 16 16:47 BST (UK) »
I'd looked at that James Pugh marriage the other day and dismissed it because the marriage register says bachelor for him. Also, his age on the census would make him nearly 10 years younger than Grace.  But the place of birth would be rather a coincidence unless we're dealing with cousins.   :-\

I haven't been able to find a marriage for James & Grace & there isn't much online from that period which is why I suggested the archives.
There's a James & Mary Pugh having children baptised in Llanfair ar y Bryn at Pentre Ty Gwyn Independent before that marriage as well. Baptism for Mary dau of James Pugh & Mary Rees 5 May 1833 at Salem Calvinisitc Methodist church in Rhandirmwyn. These are on FreeReg.
Cornwall: Allen, Bevan, Bosisto, Carnpezzack, Donithorn, Huddy, James, Retallack, Russell, Vincent, Yeoman
Cards: Thomas (Llanbadarn Fawr)
Glam: Bowler, Cram, Galloway, James, Thomas, Watkins
Lincs: Coupland, Cram
Mon: Cram, Gwyn, John, Philpot, Smart, Watkins
Pembs: Edwards (St. Dogmael's)
Yorks: Airey, Bowler, Elliott, Hare, Hewitt, Kellett, Kemp, Stephenson, Tebb

Offline ivorglyn

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Re: owen pugh born Llannarth~1811,baptised 23 december 1812 Llanllwchaiarn
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 14 September 16 17:44 BST (UK) »
Dear Osprey,If the 1851W census for Llanfairarybryn is correct then there are 8 years between their (Mary and James)births.I checked freereg,findmypast ,family search and IGI but there is no part of these records saying that James was a bachelor.Where did you get this record?The other reason I thought this was the right marriage is that James Pugh was a wheelwright.The difference for the possible births of James and Grace is also about 8 years..kind regards ivorglyn