Author Topic: Sarah Jones - born in Shropshire around 1810 or 1811  (Read 324 times)

Offline janjim

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Sarah Jones - born in Shropshire around 1810 or 1811
« on: Tuesday 13 September 16 07:32 BST (UK) »
Hi there,
We are struggling to find the correct birth of Sarah Jones, whom according to her death certificate in Australia says that she was born in Shropshire, she died on the 21st July, 1888 aged 84 years.  Death certificate says her parents were George Arthur Jones, Stonemason and Mother Susan Bailey.
We feel there could be an error in her age on her death certificate, as if she was aged 84 years, she would have been born in 1804.   The informant on the death certificate, her daughter Annie, had written up much history on the family here in Australia, and was very correct with statements made on the Cox family life, maybe this was a typo error on the certificate.

In a newspaper article in Sydney where she died at Leichhardt, the paper says Sarah was a niece of the late Sir Watkin W. Wynne of Blue Haven, Wales, whom we think could have been the 4th Baronet of Wales.   We have yet to find where the connection is to this well known family in Wales and Shropshire.

Sarah Jones married John Cox in 1832 at St. Marylebone, London, they had children, Annie Margaret, Maria, George Francis, Martha Sarah, William & Thomas (the three youngest died in their youth)
It is interesting to note that none of their children were named after Sarah's Mother Susan, which was quite unusual in those days.  Every child has been named after family members, except Susan.
The family lived at St. Johns Wood, London.   

We wish we could find her birth and also her parents marriage, so that maybe we can get a better picture on Sarah's life before she went to England to marry. Sarah's husband John Cox died in 1855 he was buried at Highgate Cemetery, St. Pancras, London, and about 10 years later, Sarah and her eldest daughter Annie migrated to Australia, settling in Sydney.    Her two other children Maria and George Francis had previously moved to Australia and very involved on the land in western NSW. 

They had family connections to William Charles Wentworth, (Vaucluse House, Sydney) the famous Australian Politician and explorer, who crossed the Blue Mountains in 1813.   The Wentworth family spent much time with the Cox family at St. Johns Wood, London during the years before John Cox's death in 1855.  Is it possible that W.C. Wentworth with his political connections, may have met up with Charles Wynn MP from 1799 - 1850.     

We just wonder how the 4th Baronet of Wales is connected to Sarah, and until we find her correct birth and her parents marriage, we will remain intrigued as to the connections.

Looking forward to anyone that can help us with this story. 

Regards
jan





New, Thorn, Bird, Ruffey, Bosley, Belcher- Newbury Berkshire
Haynes/Haines - Much Birch Herefordshire, Monmouth Wales
Kearn/Watkins- Llanllwchaiarn/Newtown, Wales, Tyberton, Herefordshire
Gwilliam - Monmouth Wales, Herefordshire
Collier, Jackson - Salford, Manchester Lancashire
Saunders - Middlesex, Devon
Benson - Edinburgh, Scotland
Callander - Falkirk, Scotland
Ambrose - Liverpool, Manchester Lancashire, Canada
Timms, Elliman - Oxfordshire, Warwickshire
Ellison - Manchester/Portsmouth Hampshir

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Online osprey

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Re: Sarah Jones - born in Shropshire around 1810 or 1811
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 13 September 16 15:01 BST (UK) »
if you mean the various Watkin Williams-Wynns of Wynnstay who were baronets, it's unlikely that a female relation of theirs married a stonemason. They were very wealthy and well connected.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_Watkin_Williams-Wynn,_4th_Baronet

You can see their marriages & children here

http://thepeerage.com/p8594.htm#i85932

This one shows married names of daughters
https://www.geni.com/people/Sir-Watkin-Williams-Wynn-4th-Baronet-of-Gray-s-Inn/6000000006999281579

The 1851 census shows her as aged 40 and place of birth looks to be Shifnal HO107/1491 folio 635 pg 76

There's a baptism in Shifnal that would put her nearer the age given at death registration, mother Susanna but father Edward
However, Edward Jones married Susanna Bayley 12 Nov 1787 in Shifnal, both otp & made their mark.
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:J37X-LYB
Possible burial for Edward aged 55 on 1 Feb 1816, abode noted as Prior's Leigh
Other siblings whose birth & baptisms also in Shifnal
Susanna 1787
Ann 1789
Jane 1791
William 1792
Edward 1794
Richard 1796
Thomas 1797
Joseph 1799
Lydia 1800
Robert in 1807

Cornwall: Allen, Bevan, Bosisto, Carnpezzack, Donithorn, Huddy, James, Retallack, Russell, Vincent, Yeoman
Cards: Thomas (Llanbadarn Fawr)
Glam: Bowler, Cram, Galloway, James, Thomas, Watkins
Lincs: Coupland, Cram
Mon: Cram, Gwyn, John, Philpot, Smart, Watkins
Pembs: Edwards (St. Dogmael's)
Yorks: Airey, Bowler, Elliott, Hare, Hewitt, Kellett, Kemp, Stephenson, Tebb

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Offline janjim

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Re: Sarah Jones - born in Shropshire around 1810 or 1811
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 13 September 16 22:12 BST (UK) »
Osprey thank you so much for all of this information.   That is exactly what we thought, there would be no way that a Stonemason would be marrying into the Watkin Williams-Wynns family.

So it looks maybe that our relation here has not fed the right information on the death certificate.

Will look further into this now.
New, Thorn, Bird, Ruffey, Bosley, Belcher- Newbury Berkshire
Haynes/Haines - Much Birch Herefordshire, Monmouth Wales
Kearn/Watkins- Llanllwchaiarn/Newtown, Wales, Tyberton, Herefordshire
Gwilliam - Monmouth Wales, Herefordshire
Collier, Jackson - Salford, Manchester Lancashire
Saunders - Middlesex, Devon
Benson - Edinburgh, Scotland
Callander - Falkirk, Scotland
Ambrose - Liverpool, Manchester Lancashire, Canada
Timms, Elliman - Oxfordshire, Warwickshire
Ellison - Manchester/Portsmouth Hampshir

Online osprey

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Re: Sarah Jones - born in Shropshire around 1810 or 1811
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 13 September 16 23:23 BST (UK) »
well, the first names of Mr Jones weren't right but he was a mason. Just checking the baptisms and on Edward's in 1794, Edward senior is noted as mason and their abode is Hem, on Richard's as stone mason, abode The Hem. Thomas & Joseph were baptised together in 1799, mother recorded as Susan. So the info wasn't horrendously wrong given the person who knew best wasn't around to give it.

 ;)
Cornwall: Allen, Bevan, Bosisto, Carnpezzack, Donithorn, Huddy, James, Retallack, Russell, Vincent, Yeoman
Cards: Thomas (Llanbadarn Fawr)
Glam: Bowler, Cram, Galloway, James, Thomas, Watkins
Lincs: Coupland, Cram
Mon: Cram, Gwyn, John, Philpot, Smart, Watkins
Pembs: Edwards (St. Dogmael's)
Yorks: Airey, Bowler, Elliott, Hare, Hewitt, Kellett, Kemp, Stephenson, Tebb

Offline janjim

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Re: Sarah Jones - born in Shropshire around 1810 or 1811
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 13 September 16 23:51 BST (UK) »
Thanks Osprey, so just wanted to ask you where is the Abode "Hem".   You would think maybe there has got to be some connection with our Sarah Jones now, but how is she a niece of the Baronet??
New, Thorn, Bird, Ruffey, Bosley, Belcher- Newbury Berkshire
Haynes/Haines - Much Birch Herefordshire, Monmouth Wales
Kearn/Watkins- Llanllwchaiarn/Newtown, Wales, Tyberton, Herefordshire
Gwilliam - Monmouth Wales, Herefordshire
Collier, Jackson - Salford, Manchester Lancashire
Saunders - Middlesex, Devon
Benson - Edinburgh, Scotland
Callander - Falkirk, Scotland
Ambrose - Liverpool, Manchester Lancashire, Canada
Timms, Elliman - Oxfordshire, Warwickshire
Ellison - Manchester/Portsmouth Hampshir

Online osprey

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Re: Sarah Jones - born in Shropshire around 1810 or 1811
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 14 September 16 11:02 BST (UK) »
I think it's The Hem.

https://www.doogal.co.uk/ShowMap.php?postcode=TF11%209PT

The info on the death registration wasn't too inaccurate, but the relationship to the Watkin Williams-Wynn family is incredibly unlikely.  There were Wynns in Shifnal, plenty of Williams & some Watkins. I suspect a little exaggeration in the family story.

 ;)   
Cornwall: Allen, Bevan, Bosisto, Carnpezzack, Donithorn, Huddy, James, Retallack, Russell, Vincent, Yeoman
Cards: Thomas (Llanbadarn Fawr)
Glam: Bowler, Cram, Galloway, James, Thomas, Watkins
Lincs: Coupland, Cram
Mon: Cram, Gwyn, John, Philpot, Smart, Watkins
Pembs: Edwards (St. Dogmael's)
Yorks: Airey, Bowler, Elliott, Hare, Hewitt, Kellett, Kemp, Stephenson, Tebb