Author Topic: Samuel Smith c 1808  (Read 5260 times)

Offline groom

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Re: Samuel Smith,born 1805, butcher marr. Fanny Lovell-daughter kerenhappuch
« Reply #18 on: Monday 27 February 17 22:40 GMT (UK) »
Hi Judy, welcome to Rootschat. What information are you looking for?
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Offline Judith Haselton

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Re: Samuel Smith,born 1805, butcher marr. Fanny Lovell-daughter kerenhappuch
« Reply #19 on: Monday 27 February 17 22:52 GMT (UK) »
The given name Kerenhappuch runs through the family starting with Samuel Smith's mother Kerenhappuch Gale. She was previously married to a White or Whyatt and her 3rd husband was John Smith.
 I believe I have  details about Samuel born 1805 Chequers or Bozeat and his family in Australia. I noticed on Roots chat that there was what I believe to be incorrect details posted between 2 parties so if they are interested I may be able to help them.

Judy H

Moderator comment: threads merged for clarity.

Offline redtonyt

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #20 on: Sunday 12 March 17 09:42 GMT (UK) »
Hi Judy,

I apologise for not replying sooner but selling and moving home has got in the way!

I originated the thread looking for “Samuel Smith c1808”  As I explained my opening remarks I am helping out a friend and, pretty well all I have found is contained within the thread.

The maiden name of Gale, I have seen on various trees but, have not been able to confirm by my research.

I would be most happy for you to post any information you hold and, enlighten me as to any incorrect details that have been posted.

Best wishes,
Tony

Offline Judith Haselton

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #21 on: Monday 13 March 17 02:41 GMT (UK) »
Samuel Smith born Bedford 23.3.1805 and died in Adelaide 28.4.1859 age 53.  He marr. Fanny Lovell Riddington 19.3.1835.  His parents were John Smith and Kerenhapprich Gale 1767-1839.
 wondered if her parents were Samuel Gale [a weaver] and Lidia and John Gale bp 26.6.1748 was therir son and Kerenhapprich's brother.  It has been suggested that the latter John Gale was her husband so can you enlighten me?
Cheers,
Judy



Offline redtonyt

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #22 on: Monday 13 March 17 07:37 GMT (UK) »
Hi Judy,

Thanks for your prompt reply.  Now, I am sorry for being a pedantic nuisance but can I ask, where is the baptism of Samuel Smith sourced from?

Yet another nit-pick; I have spent quite some time trying to find Karren Happuch Gale and possible marriages without any success. Do you have any firm dates and or venues?

The only John Smith marriage to a K-H that has been found can be seen on this link,
https://archive.org/stream/bedfordshirepari28bedf#page/n35/mode/2up

I apologise for my negativity, it may be something to do with my previous line of work.  Also my friend is very particular about sourcing the information in his pedigree.

Tony :-[


Offline johnP-bedford

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #23 on: Monday 13 March 17 10:22 GMT (UK) »
Thurleigh marriages

6 Nov 1764 Thomas Boon to Kerenhappuch WYATT (don't say she's a widow)

Cannot see a burial for Thomas Boon but Beds Archives have an Admon ref ABP/A 1767/14

15 Nov 1773 John Gale to Kerenhappuch Boon, widow

When did John Gale die for this Keren to marry John Smith (if she did, that is!) & when/where was that?

Also note that a Karenhappuch Gale was buried at Thurleigh on 5 Feb 1805
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Partridge - North Beds; Northants & Peterborough
Bishop - Bedford; Hunts, Hemingford Grey
Allen - Hunts, Hemingford Abbotts
Clement - Croydon
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Offline bedfordshire boy

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #24 on: Monday 13 March 17 10:59 GMT (UK) »
Someone who married first in 1764 is not going to be still having children after 1800

John - see your post #4 for details of the marriage of a John Smith to Kerenhappuch Wildman alias Tyler.

It strikes me that there's a lot of speculation about this family! It's always difficult when there's no baptism to establish who the parents were.
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Beds:   Cople: Luke/Spencer
            Everton: Hale
            Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey/Rook
            Potton:  Merrill
            Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey/Rook
            Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt
Hunts:   Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock
            Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn         
Cambs: Bourn: Bowd
            Eltisley: Medlock
            Graveley: Ford/Revell

Offline bedfordshire boy

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #25 on: Monday 13 March 17 14:43 GMT (UK) »
I think Judith's, and three Ancestry tree's information about Kerenhappuch Gale being the wife of John Smith is wrong.

John posted the details of John Smith's 1796 marriage to Kerenhappuch Wildman alias Tyler, widow in reply #4.

This appears to be her first marriage:  in Thurleigh on 24 Sep 1788 to John Wildman, as Kerenhappuch Jones. Her baptism in Bletsoe on 19 May 1766, daughter of Low and Charity  Jones, fits much better with her having children in the early 1800s, clearly impossible for Kerenhappuch Gale. It also fits with details posted earlier by Tony about Low Smith (reply #5). What it doesn't do though, is prove conclusively that Samuel Smith was the son of John and Kerenhappuch.  Hopefully Judith's birth date for him of 23 Mar 1805 will provide the proof. Fair bit of circumstantial evidence though.

David
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Beds:   Cople: Luke/Spencer
            Everton: Hale
            Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey/Rook
            Potton:  Merrill
            Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey/Rook
            Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt
Hunts:   Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock
            Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn         
Cambs: Bourn: Bowd
            Eltisley: Medlock
            Graveley: Ford/Revell

Offline johnP-bedford

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Re: Samuel Smith c 1808
« Reply #26 on: Monday 13 March 17 17:09 GMT (UK) »
I concur David,   

John Wildman, senior, carpenter was buried Thurleigh on 1 Feb 1795 just time enough for her to recover & then marry John Smith on 9 June 1796. She is the Kerenhappuch Jones baptised Bletsoe in May 1766. As Keren... Smith she died in 1840 aged 72 so born c.1768

And we can disregard the Kerenhappuch Wyatt, who married Thomas Boon 1764 & then John Gale in 1773 as being out of it agewise, reckon she's the Keren... Gale buried 1805

However what became of the Karenhappuch Wyatt, daughter of Thomas Wyatt, junior, famer & wife Elizabeth who was baptised Thurleigh on 1 Nov 1768 ... or have I just added to the confusion.
Both Thomas Wyatt senior & junior were buried at Thurleigh in 1771. What did wife Elizabeth do ?
Its interesting that Low Jones married Charity Wyatt at Thurleigh on 19 Nov 1764. 

John     
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Partridge - North Beds; Northants & Peterborough
Bishop - Bedford; Hunts, Hemingford Grey
Allen - Hunts, Hemingford Abbotts
Clement - Croydon
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