Fred METCALFE, 1887 and a general question

[Shiny1]

Hi All,

I'm after some help with a relative but also in general.

I have found Fred METCALFE born in 1887 in Darlington, according to the 1911 census he is living in a barracks somewhere as a private soldier with the 15th Hussars. Is there a way to find out where the barracks was that he was living in and was he still serving during WW1?

I don't know anything about him and this is where my general question comes in, is there a way I can find out a date and place of death for people?

I have quite a lot of relatives on my tree who are just names really, most have a year of birth but nothing more, how can I at least get their age when their DOB means they would have died after 1911?

[KGarrad]

For details of the 1911 census, you have to pay!
Or get yourself to your local library - they may have Ancestry Library Edition, which is free.
Or maybe FindMyPast.

For deaths, look at FreeBMD.org.uk, which is a transcript of the Registered Births, Marriages and Deaths in England & Wales.

[chempat]

If you have an exact date of birth, then this might be the wrong man (I can see a possible baptism in November 1887 from Ancestry)?

Deaths December quarter 1969 
Fred   Metcalfe   (born 21 December 1887) died in Durham S E  1a   1595

Or the person giving the death information was wrong?

Or the baptism information is wrong.

[Shiny1]

If you have an exact date of birth, then this might be the wrong man (I can see a possible baptism in November 1887 from Ancestry)?

Thanks for the help, I don't have an exact date, all I've been working off is his age in the 1901 census and counting back.

His entry in the 1911 census was suggested by Ancestry but seemed to be the best match for him in 1911. I haven't come across one like that before but thought if I go backwards and forwards a few pages I might have found a barracks name but didn't.

I want to know what happened to him and managed to find a couple of medal index cards that could be his but haven't really got any way to confirm they are his for definite.

I'm still quite new to this and didn't know if there was a way to confirm his date of death and other people in general. I did searches on free BMD but it's knowing how to say "that's the person I'm looking for".

Michael

[BumbleB]

This might be a good place to ask the question of where the 15th were stationed in 1911.

http://www.lightdragoons.org.uk/museums.html

[Annette7]

Fred enlisted with the 15th Hussars in 1905 - there is a army record on FindMyPast - his regt. nos. are 46383 and A/no.533118.   He appears to have served from 1905 through to 1921 but not always in 15th Hussars (at one time 3rd, another 7th. and Army Tank Corps).   For the period you are interested in they were at Potchefstroom, Transvaal, South Africa.

His parents were George Metcalf/e (name continually switches between both spellings) and Alice Dale who married Mar.qtr.1877 Richmond, Yorkshire.

Fred's birth registered as Metcalf in Dec.1887 Darlington and baptised as Metcalfe 30/11/1887 Darlington (so clearly born before 30th November and not the one who died in 1969 who had birthdate in December).

Annette

[Annette7]

Reading your posts again I'm getting a bit confused.

I can't work out whether the Fred born Darlington is definitely 'your' man (if so, then surely you must know what became of him after 1911 if he's an ancestor) or whether you have a Fred Metcalfe b.1887 who you are trying to establish is the one born in Darlington.   Do you understand what I mean?

From the various records I can see at least 2 Fred Metcalf/e's born 1887 - one is the one born Darlington to George and Alice (born before 30/11/1887 when baptised) and the other born Keighley, Yorkshire to a Frederick and Jessie.   The latter baptised in 1888 shows birthdate of 27/12/1887 but I think 27th is an error and should read 21st.   This man was married to an Edith Foulds in 1906 (Bradford) and then they moved to Rochdale where they had their family.   Sometime after 1939 they moved to Durham where deaths for both Fred and Edith are shown registered at Durham Central.

I just thought we should establish which Fred you are connected to as the one born in Durham (Darlington) we can follow until 1921 (from army record) and the other Fred born same year at Keighley, Yorkshire moved to Rochdale after marriage but both he and wife Edith ultimately end up dying in Durham - these are definitely 2 different Fred's.

In answer to earlier questions, no there is no easy way of tying up birthdates/death dates for people.   People often moved around a great deal (as with Fred/Edith above who went from Yorkshire to Lancashire and then Durham).   All comes down to doing research and if information that you want is not available online (other than BMD registrations) then unless you are able to visit the record offices of the places concerned to search for the information yourself then your only option is to purchase the certificate of the relevant event. 

In this instance with the 2 Fred's luckily baptisms for both are online - Darlington Fred bp.30/11/1887 so born before that date, Keighley Fred born 21st December 1887 but not baptised until May 1888).   

Annette
 

[Shiny1]

Hi Annette,

Thank you so much for your help, the information you have found is great.

The Fred I'm interested in is the one born in Darlington to George and Alice. My direct connection is to Alice Dale, she is the one who's story I know. Fred is one of her children who I'm just starting to look at.

All I had for him was a name and approximate year of birth from counting back on the census. I found a Fred Metcalfe on the 1911 census living in the barracks who seems to match with the Fred Metcalfe I was trying to trace so now I'm trying to work out if he is definitely Alice's son.

I think on the balance of probability he is the right man but I suspect unless I find a service record listing Alice and George as his next of kin I won't know 100%.

Thanks for your advice about the birth / deaths, that is what I thought but hoped I was wrong.

Thanks again for all of your help,

Michael