Author Topic: William Jelliff and Louisa Griffin  (Read 1827 times)

Online BumbleB

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Re: William Jelliff and Louisa Griffin
« Reply #9 on: Saturday 18 February 17 09:13 GMT (UK) »
On Mary Ann's baptism entry - 17 December 1833 - William and Louisa Jellif of Lawley Street.  William is a Brick Maker. - transcribed as Tellif.

Transcriptions and NBI are merely finding aids.  They are NOT a substitute for original record entries.
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Offline avm228

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Re: William Jelliff and Louisa Griffin
« Reply #10 on: Saturday 18 February 17 09:19 GMT (UK) »
Just in case Louisa didn't die but the marriage to William Jelliff broke down:

Marriage, Edgbaston Parish Church

1 August 1836

James Laurence, bachelor, and Louisa Jelliff, spinster (James signs as James Lawrence)

After banns.

Witnesses: Jane Laurence & William Secton/Sexton?
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline Newbabe

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Re: William Jelliff and Louisa Griffin
« Reply #11 on: Saturday 18 February 17 16:11 GMT (UK) »
Why are things so complicated.  I have rechecked some copy documents I have and in the 1851 census for Benjamin Griffin and wife Ann (who I thought were my Louisa Griffins parents) I find staying with them is their daughter, aged 38, LOUISA LAURENCE.  As we know a James Laurence/Lawrence married a LOUISA JELLIFF 1/8/1836. 3 years after my Mary Ann Jelliffe was born.  I have also found in a 1849 Trade Directory a William Jelliffe living in Garrison Lane who is a Brick Maker and Beer Retailer.  Also  An Occupational and Quarter Sessions record again for 1849
for William Jelliffe living in Coventry Street, Helmingford, Birmingham who is a Victular.
SO - is there a bit of jiggery pokery going on and Louisa Jelliff is a bigamist?
Were they divorced, which is why she thinks she is a spinster?
Or am I barking up the wrong tree?
I am more confused than ever.
Val

Offline avm228

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Re: William Jelliff and Louisa Griffin
« Reply #12 on: Saturday 18 February 17 16:18 GMT (UK) »
Ah! Well that is very interesting.  It does look therefore as though the 1836 marriage was of "your" Louisa, pretending to be a spinster.

Bigamy was much more common than divorce at this date, and is not all that unusual to find. Most cases were not prosecuted, either because the bigamous couple removed themselves to a new community where the history was not known, or because the estranged spouse and others in their community accepted the situation and didn't report the bigamy. (No doubt there are other possible reasons, too).
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)


Offline avm228

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Re: William Jelliff and Louisa Griffin
« Reply #13 on: Saturday 18 February 17 16:32 GMT (UK) »
I see that Louisa Lawrence (this spelling) is still with her mother Ann Griffin at 8 Tennant St, Birmingham in 1861 as a 47 yr old widowed laundress, plus three Lawrence children (John 18, James 16, Sarah 13). Census ref is RG9/2137/123/4.  This is the same address where you have found her in 1851.

Louisa Lawrence is still at 8 Tennant St in 1871: RG10/3101/101/3 (daughter Sarah A, 23, with her) and in 1881: RG11/2978/5/3.
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline avm228

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Re: William Jelliff and Louisa Griffin
« Reply #14 on: Saturday 18 February 17 16:50 GMT (UK) »
The first child for the Lawrence couple, born some 8 months after their marriage:

Baptism, St Philip, Birmingham: 15 May 1837

Alfred John Lawrence (born 27 March 1837)

Parents: James, stensill [sic] colourer, and Louisa, of Lawley Street.
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

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Re: William Jelliff and Louisa Griffin
« Reply #15 on: Saturday 18 February 17 16:56 GMT (UK) »
1841 census:

Court No 7, Great Bow St, St Thomas Birmingham

James Lawrence 25 J Bricklayer
Lucy do 25
Maryan do 5
Alfred do 4
Jane do 2

All born in county except for James.
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline Newbabe

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Re: William Jelliff and Louisa Griffin
« Reply #16 on: Sunday 19 February 17 10:54 GMT (UK) »
Well it is certainly looking more and more likely William and Louisa separated/divorced, and James and Louisa lived together/married bigamously/married legally.  It looks as if Louisa took Mary Ann as she seems to appear in the 1841 census (by 1851 she is married to John Busby).  Because William and James are in the same profession i.e. brick maker and brick layer and all concerned still appear to be living locally to one another, I can only assume separation was amicable.
Val