Author Topic: Julia Murray b 1849 to Philip & Anne  (Read 375 times)

Offline josey

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Julia Murray b 1849 to Philip & Anne
« on: Thursday 23 February 17 12:04 GMT (UK) »
Just to explain that despite all the other placenames here - this is a Tipperary family!!

I am excited because, thanks to the new GRO index, I have discovered Julia Murray - a new sibling to my g grandfather Patrick. She was born in Weedon Barracks, Daventry, Northamptonshire on 20 Feb 1849. Her father Philip was a sergeant in the 87th Regiment who married Anne Sheedy in 1831 in Borrisokane. They had a daughter Mary in 1832 & Philip enlisted in Nenagh in 1837. No children found baptised between those dates in the local parish registers. So later children may have been born anywhere Philip was stationed & after he was a sergeant who could take his wife with him. Patrick was born in Dundee Barracks in 1846.

So - can anyone please help me with finding out what happened to Julia? In the 1851 Army Index, Philip is in Firozpur/Ferozepur presumably with his young family. By 1859, when Philip is discharged, they are back in Tipperary. His service records state he spent 7 years in the East Indies. I have looked on the 1901 & 1911 Ireland censuses for Julia [no surname] in Tipperary but can find none born in England.

Julia may have of course have died in India or Ireland and if not probably married in Ireland, sometime after the late 1860s. Philip died in Cashel in 1864 so it seems the family stayed in Tipperary.

Thanks, Josey
Seeking: baptism Philip Murray 1813 nr Chatham Kent, death Ralph James Dunn b 1808 1861 - 1868 in Newington 1861
IRE: Kik DRAY[EA], PURCELL, WHITE: Mea LYNCH: Tip MURRAY, SHEEDY: Wem ALLEN, ENGLISHBY; Dub PENROSE: Lim DUNN[E], FRAWLEY, WILLIAMS.
87th Regiment RIF: MURRAY
ENG; Marylebone HAYTER, TROU[W]SDALE, Con HAMPTON, TREMELLING Wry CLEGG, HOLLAND, HORSEFIELD Coventry McGINTY
CAN; Nova Scotia [Halifax, Pictou]: HOLLAND, WHITE, WILLIAMSON

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Offline josey

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Re: Julia Murray b 1849 to Philip & Anne
« Reply #1 on: Friday 24 February 17 15:47 GMT (UK) »
Whoops deleted as a mistake  :-[
Seeking: baptism Philip Murray 1813 nr Chatham Kent, death Ralph James Dunn b 1808 1861 - 1868 in Newington 1861
IRE: Kik DRAY[EA], PURCELL, WHITE: Mea LYNCH: Tip MURRAY, SHEEDY: Wem ALLEN, ENGLISHBY; Dub PENROSE: Lim DUNN[E], FRAWLEY, WILLIAMS.
87th Regiment RIF: MURRAY
ENG; Marylebone HAYTER, TROU[W]SDALE, Con HAMPTON, TREMELLING Wry CLEGG, HOLLAND, HORSEFIELD Coventry McGINTY
CAN; Nova Scotia [Halifax, Pictou]: HOLLAND, WHITE, WILLIAMSON

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Offline josey

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Re: Julia Murray b 1849 to Philip & Anne
« Reply #2 on: Monday 20 March 17 12:40 GMT (UK) »
Have found a possible marriage but no image on irishgenealogy.ie
Name   JULIA MURRAY
Date of Event   1873
Group Registration ID   N/R
SR District/Reg Area   Carrick on Suir
Returns Year   1873
Returns Quarter   1
Returns Volume No   9
Returns Page No   273
Julia's father Philip stated on discharge from the army in 1859 that he was going to live in Carrick-on-Suir. I do not know the spouse's name for this 1873 marriage. Is there any way I can find out from the index?

There are some baptisms on familysearch Ellen 1868 & James 1872 children of William O'Brien + Julia Murray in Clogheen, Co Tipp in 1868 - 1872 which may be from this that marriage.
Name:   William O'Brien
Gender:   Male
Marital Status:   Single
Age:   30
Birth Date:   1836
Marriage Date:   24 Jul 1866
Marriage Place:   Clogheen, Tipperary, Ireland
Father:   Patrick O'Brien
Spouse:   Johanna Murry
FHL Film Number:   101499

Ah that has Johann's father as Richard.

Although only just about late enough for MY Julia, I found 2 sons Michael 1866 born Tipperary Town Cornelius Hanly & Julia (Murray)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1866/03528/2298600.pdf
James 1869 https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1869/03408/2249979.pdf
Could do with finding marriage of Cornelius & Julia...


Seeking: baptism Philip Murray 1813 nr Chatham Kent, death Ralph James Dunn b 1808 1861 - 1868 in Newington 1861
IRE: Kik DRAY[EA], PURCELL, WHITE: Mea LYNCH: Tip MURRAY, SHEEDY: Wem ALLEN, ENGLISHBY; Dub PENROSE: Lim DUNN[E], FRAWLEY, WILLIAMS.
87th Regiment RIF: MURRAY
ENG; Marylebone HAYTER, TROU[W]SDALE, Con HAMPTON, TREMELLING Wry CLEGG, HOLLAND, HORSEFIELD Coventry McGINTY
CAN; Nova Scotia [Halifax, Pictou]: HOLLAND, WHITE, WILLIAMSON

Offline dathai

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Re: Julia Murray b 1849 to Philip & Anne
« Reply #3 on: Monday 20 March 17 19:32 GMT (UK) »
There are these two marriages in Tipperary
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FGZJ-FYK

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FG8M-5L9

but be warned there is a Philip Murray living in Tipperary North Riding in 1851 parish of Upperchurch
http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/

Offline josey

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Re: Julia Murray b 1849 to Philip & Anne
« Reply #4 on: Monday 20 March 17 21:35 GMT (UK) »
Thank you dathai; the first marriage is of a Mary born ca 1844 - Philip & Ann had a Mary in 1832 though she may have died & this is another daughter Mary; the second is of a James born ca 1847. It mat be worth a few euros to get the certificates to see if father Philip is army pensioner deceased, as well as the 1873 Carrick one for Julia Murray.

Not to fudge the subject of the thread, but the reason I think Philip was from Killeen near Borrisokane & is not the Upperchurch one (thank you for the pointer) is that Philip & a Mary Sheedy (may be Ann's sister?) were sponsors at baptisms in Borrisokane of children of a Michael Hogan & Judy Murray (may be Philip's sister?) of Killeen in the mid 1830s & Michael Hogan was a sponsor to the 1832 baptism of Mary Murray. I mentioned these in this thread, (also found Philip Murray in Griffiths for Killeen):
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=762070.msg6134537#msg6134537
and I think Philip had a brother Daniel mentioned in this thread:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=766818.msg6188879#msg6188879

ADDED: regarding Mary who married William Bourke, there is a widowed William Bourke aged 60 in 1901 in Upperchurch, which MAY be widower of Mary daughter of the Upperchurch Philip  ???
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai003905525/
Seeking: baptism Philip Murray 1813 nr Chatham Kent, death Ralph James Dunn b 1808 1861 - 1868 in Newington 1861
IRE: Kik DRAY[EA], PURCELL, WHITE: Mea LYNCH: Tip MURRAY, SHEEDY: Wem ALLEN, ENGLISHBY; Dub PENROSE: Lim DUNN[E], FRAWLEY, WILLIAMS.
87th Regiment RIF: MURRAY
ENG; Marylebone HAYTER, TROU[W]SDALE, Con HAMPTON, TREMELLING Wry CLEGG, HOLLAND, HORSEFIELD Coventry McGINTY
CAN; Nova Scotia [Halifax, Pictou]: HOLLAND, WHITE, WILLIAMSON

Offline josey

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Re: Julia Murray b 1849 to Philip & Anne
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 21 March 17 09:39 GMT (UK) »
When I get a chance today I will browse the Upperchurch parish register at http://registers.nli.ie/registers to see if I can find any baptisms with father Philip Murray of Upperchurch.
Seeking: baptism Philip Murray 1813 nr Chatham Kent, death Ralph James Dunn b 1808 1861 - 1868 in Newington 1861
IRE: Kik DRAY[EA], PURCELL, WHITE: Mea LYNCH: Tip MURRAY, SHEEDY: Wem ALLEN, ENGLISHBY; Dub PENROSE: Lim DUNN[E], FRAWLEY, WILLIAMS.
87th Regiment RIF: MURRAY
ENG; Marylebone HAYTER, TROU[W]SDALE, Con HAMPTON, TREMELLING Wry CLEGG, HOLLAND, HORSEFIELD Coventry McGINTY
CAN; Nova Scotia [Halifax, Pictou]: HOLLAND, WHITE, WILLIAMSON

Offline josey

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Re: Julia Murray b 1849 to Philip & Anne
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 22 March 17 14:39 GMT (UK) »
OK so on rootsireland.ie I found 3 children for Upperchurch Philip Murray & Winifred Burke; Judith 1836, Mary 1839 & Patrick 1843. It appear Upperchurch Philip may have died 1865, farmer of Gortkelly, cod scrofula 18 mnths, age 70 informant Philip Murray; Winifred may have died 1866 aged 70, farmer's widow of Gortkelly, of stitch 1 wk informant James Murray. This Winifred does seems a little old but perhaps James didn't know her age.

Rootsireland.ie were offering a good deal on a month's subs so I need to get all the info from it I can!!
Seeking: baptism Philip Murray 1813 nr Chatham Kent, death Ralph James Dunn b 1808 1861 - 1868 in Newington 1861
IRE: Kik DRAY[EA], PURCELL, WHITE: Mea LYNCH: Tip MURRAY, SHEEDY: Wem ALLEN, ENGLISHBY; Dub PENROSE: Lim DUNN[E], FRAWLEY, WILLIAMS.
87th Regiment RIF: MURRAY
ENG; Marylebone HAYTER, TROU[W]SDALE, Con HAMPTON, TREMELLING Wry CLEGG, HOLLAND, HORSEFIELD Coventry McGINTY
CAN; Nova Scotia [Halifax, Pictou]: HOLLAND, WHITE, WILLIAMSON

Offline josey

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Re: Julia Murray b 1849 to Philip & Anne
« Reply #7 on: Friday 07 April 17 14:39 BST (UK) »
OK just reporting back as I got some research photocopies from Roscommon.

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FGZJ-FYK
Looks like the GRO sent the wrong marriage - I got William Scott & Maria Murphy on 9 Jun 1868 not William Bourke & Mary Murray on 23 Jun 1868. rootsireland.ie show that Mary Murray is daughter of Philip Murray farmer Gortkelly, so again the Upperchurch Philip.

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FG8M-5L9

James' father indeed Philip but a farmer, Gortkelly - so this is most likely the Upperchurch Philip.

I also got the Julia Murray/William Brien marriage in 1873 in Carrick on Suir but Julia aged 30 so born ca 1843 & her father is John a labourer AND the Carrick on Suir is in Co Waterford not Co Tipperary.
Seeking: baptism Philip Murray 1813 nr Chatham Kent, death Ralph James Dunn b 1808 1861 - 1868 in Newington 1861
IRE: Kik DRAY[EA], PURCELL, WHITE: Mea LYNCH: Tip MURRAY, SHEEDY: Wem ALLEN, ENGLISHBY; Dub PENROSE: Lim DUNN[E], FRAWLEY, WILLIAMS.
87th Regiment RIF: MURRAY
ENG; Marylebone HAYTER, TROU[W]SDALE, Con HAMPTON, TREMELLING Wry CLEGG, HOLLAND, HORSEFIELD Coventry McGINTY
CAN; Nova Scotia [Halifax, Pictou]: HOLLAND, WHITE, WILLIAMSON