Ellen Williams born 1853

[josey]

I would like some help with Ellen Williams, please.

She was born
WILLIAMS, ELLEN       MMN CRAWLEY      [should be Frawley]
GRO Reference: 1853  M Quarter in MARYLEBONE  Volume 01A  Page 437

Her sister Margaret born 1850 & both parents William Williams a labourer & Johanna [Frawley] all died in Jan & Feb 1855, leaving an older sister Mary born 1841, & brother John born 1845.

I am pretty sure I have found her in 1861
1861 inmate aged 6 in St Marylebone Parochial School at Southall : RG 9; Piece: 770; Folio: 26; Page: 8

& in 1871 2 possible sightings as (1) RG10; Piece: 535; Folio: 99; Page: 34 @ 27 Charles St, Tower Hamlets age 17 born London servant (2) RG10; Piece: 107; Folio: 12; Page: 26 @ 23 Denbigh St, Westminster age 18 general servant born Pimlico

I found a possible marriage
Marriages Jun 1879 
CASTLE    John Richard        Kensington    1a   233    
WILLIAMS    Ellen        Kensington    1a   233     father William labourer
though in 1881, 1891 censuses this Ellen states she was born in Herefordshire so probably not.

Also 2 possible deaths
Deaths Dec 1878 
WILLIAMS    Ellen    35    Marylebone    1a   455 but this is before a photo dated by kind rc'ers to the early 1880s
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=732253.msg5773110#msg5773110
Deaths Dec 1896
Williams    Ellen    34    Marylebone    1a   362  trying to find this Ellen on censuses to determine whether she is single or married; I may order death cert. 

So, does this name ring bells with anyone? What other routes can I take to find out what happened to her?

Thanks, Josey

[suzard]

I would like some help with Ellen Williams, please.

She was born
WILLIAMS, ELLEN       MMN CRAWLEY      [should be Frawley]
GRO Reference: 1853  M Quarter in MARYLEBONE  Volume 01A  Page 437

Her sister Margaret born 1850 & both parents William Williams a labourer & Johanna [Frawley] all died in Jan & Feb 1855, leaving an older sister Mary born 1841, & brother John born 1845.

not to do with Ellen - but may be of interest??

Wapping Workhouse admissions Stepney
24 Sept 1855
Johanna Williams destitute to be passed
Mary Ann Williams child ill 18mths

as your Johanna died Feb 1855  I know it can't be her but can't find another Johanna

Suz

[josey]

Interesting Suz, thanks.

[suzard]

there are lots of Ellen Williams 1853 in and out of workhouses-this one caught my eye

Workhouse & Infirmary register
admissions
Westminster
St Marylebone
John Williams age 11 and Ellen Williams age 2 admitted 10 Mar 1855 from 99 Devonshire St
admitted by R.J.Tubbs

Suz

[suzard]

Burial of Johnanna Williams St Maryebone
address Workhouse

Workhouse admission
St marylebone
6 Oct 1847 to Infirmary

Johanna Williams age 30
Supposed to be in labour children in Workhouse



26 Feb 1848
Johannah Williams age 30 address 10 Paul St
children Mary 7, John 3, Danl 2mths
Husband absconded
remarks Advertise Husband

Suz

[josey]

Oh, gosh...thanks. Query taking a bit of a turn & finding out a lot more about Johanna....

Yes, 99 Devonshire St was the address at which Joanna died so the 1855 admission definitely 'my' John [g grandfather] & Ellen. So the 1847 admission 'in labour' was probably with Daniel [2 months on 1848 admission]....

No suitable birth found [even without forename or as 'Male'] . Maybe this death? will check GRO for age
Deaths Jun 1849   
Williams    Daniel        Marylebone    1   163

ADDED:
WILLIAMS, DANIEL       1     
GRO Reference: 1849  J Quarter in MARYLEBONE  Volume 01  Page 163

Address for John 's 1845 birth 6 Nightingale St, Marylebone

[josey]

I know it can't be her but can't find another Johanna

I did find some time ago an Old Bailey report
https://www.oldbaileyonline.org/browse.jsp?id=def2-1144-18500610&div=t18500610-1144#highlight
SUSANNAH BREESON, JOHANNA WILLIAMS, Theft > pocketpicking, 10th June 1850.
Breeson age 41 found guilty confined 12 months, Williams not guilty. Just where this took place is not mentioned, but Breeson & her family lived near a pub called the White Hart & the chap she stole from was from the ship The Manchester - so may have been near the river.
1841 Shadwell & Wapping
HO107; Piece: 703; Book: 4; Civil Parish: St Paul Shadwell; County: Middlesex; Enumeration District: 4; Folio: 16; Page: 27
a Susan Bensen age '30' [corrected by 2 people on ancestry to Breeson] with family so may be this Susannah. So possibly the Johannah Williams admitted to Wapping WH is this defendant & lived in Wapping also as she was friends with Susannah Breeson??

[josey]

Slightly off topic but now I have found this birth & death which could be a child between Daniel  & Ellen.
Birth
WILLIAMS, MARIAN       CROWLEY     
GRO Reference: 1851  S Quarter in MARYLEBONE  Volume 01  Page 160
Death
Deaths Mar 1852   [cannot find on GRO for age]
WILLIAMS    Marian        Marylebone    1a   341

[josey]

26 Feb 1848
Johannah Williams age 30 address 10 Paul St
children Mary 7, John 3, Danl 2mths
Husband absconded
remarks Advertise Husband

Anyone know where would the advertisements have appeared? Police Gazette or an ordinary paper?