Charles Queen - Dipton, Co Durham

[keyboard86]

Hi Charles is very hard to locate with any certainty, but is this the probate for his wife Lily:-

Lily Queen Widow of 49, Hestobel Gardens, Bishop Aukland died 6th March 1942 Administration Durham to Alfred Golightly Tar & Slag Merchant Effects £174 3s 11d

Possibly only the purchase of that marriage certificate will provide more clues?
Keyboard86

Hi another possible one to look at is the Marjorie Baxter born 9th February 1918 who died March 1978 aged 60 Spilsby Lincolnshire,  Married Arthur W Baxter in 1945 as Marjorie Golightly b possibly March qtr 1918 Sedgefield 10a 296 mmn Machin.

There is a connection with the Probate above and this Marjorie?!
Keyboard86

EDIT possibly the Alfred Golightly who married an Elizabeth Machin Durham 1908?

[Elliven]

Yes, this is the probate for his wife, Lily!

The interesting thing is that she had a brother Alfred; is this possibly the Alfred who married Elizabeth Machin.  Marjory Baxter (nee Golightly) would be illegitimate if she was Lily's daughter as Charles would have been away fighting at the time she was conceived which would be close to the time that Charles was killed. If not she would have been baptised Queen.

[keyboard86]

Hi again, I should have asked before,  just what is your interest in Charles?

The only likely birth of the Charles in 1911 Dipton is a Charles Patrick QUIN December qtr 1888 Tynemouth 10b 262 mmn MULDOON?
Keyboard86
EDIT As an example his sister Lily in 1891 census looks to be the birth registration of a Lilian QUIN June qtr 1886 Tynemouth 10b 280 mmn MULDSON?

You are by the looks of it assuming the Lily Queen probate is the same Lily who married Charles?

[Elliven]

Hello keyboard 86,

Firstly, My interest in Charles is connected with a totally different research project.  For many years I have been researching the history of local pubs in this area and I had his name as licensee of a pub in this village.  Almost without exception other local historians have dismissed my ideas about this; their argument being that the pub I had listed had never existed.  I have only lived here for 30 odd years - so what did I know?  I have now proved that the pub DID exist and that he was the licensee.  So now, I am trying to find information on the man.

His wife, Lily, came from the Bishop Auckland area and returned there towards the end of the First World War - when Charles was killed in action.  So I am certain it is the same Lily.  Charles was born in 1890 in Choppington, Blyth, Northumberland (1911 Census).

I am certain this is the same couple and I am trying to build up a picture of the family and their time in the pub.  Lily's background was as a domestic so it is likely that the substantial value of the probate came from the business and, after Charles died, the sale of it.

I sincerely hope I am not barking up the wrong tree - just when I have proved the existence of the pub and him as licensee.

[keyboard86]

  OK Answered well, so if he was a Beer Seller 1911 and was killed 1918 in Egypt, what years was he the licensee of the pub?

The thing with this family in the case of the potential birth of a Charles Patrick QUIN, changing to plain Charles Queen, Jane possibly Jane Ann Muldoon b Maryport, who remarried after the death of her husband John Queen/Quinn date/place unknown/marriage unknown etc etc, as Jane Ann COLLINS?
Keyboard86

[Elliven]

He could not have been in the pub earlier than 1908 (unless licensing laws were different then) and he went to war in the earlier drafts so I would guess 1914-15.  At any rate the pub was in other hands by 1916 - that is the first reference to the new landlord - but it is possible that the new man was hired to run the place whilst Charles was at war.  The new licensee was in his fifties so would not have been called up.

[keyboard86]

Hi again, can I please have your thoughts on the births shown above, and why if possibly correct Jane remarried as a Collins and had children in 1901 registered as Collins in a Queen household, did the 1911 for Charles also mention Confectionery and was the pub in the area of Delight Bank?
I can see now why you possibly do not wish to purchase the marriage/birth certificates. but if we are to nail down the Charles with Lily it would help!
Keyboard86

[Elliven]

The births you have shown are a mystery to me.  The thought of Charles Patrick Quin changing to Charles Queen begs the question - Why?  As for Jane, I have no idea.

Charles was mentioned with confectioner as a secondary occupation and the pub/alehouse was in a street named Delight Bank.  This street was long since demolished but it is still known as Delight Bank - between that street of houses and the next street down (which is still there) was the entrance and railway access to the Delight Pit - hence the name.

Originally Dipton was three hamlets but by this time it had grown to be a large village and most of the inhabitants were outsiders who had come in to take work in the three separate mines in the village and the many drift mines.  It was a large and thirsty village with 13 pubs and a working men's club.  Charles probably came looking for work in the mines but found it more profitable and safer selling beer.  All it required in those days was 10 shillings a year for a licence and the price of a barrel of beer. 

[keyboard86]

  This is one of the most difficult searches I have had for many years, their must be reasons for all that has been supplied, the one that would really help is if we can locate Jane ( Ann) b c 1860 Maryport, as surname Muld* does not come up, oh and why Collins at remarriage!
Keyboard86