Author Topic: This branch of the RIDLER family has me confused.  (Read 5769 times)

Offline Lucy2

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 15,433
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: This branch of the RIDLER family has me confused.
« Reply #9 on: Sunday 05 March 17 03:02 GMT (UK) »
It seems that the births of the following children may have originally been registered as PHIPPS.

1909 - PHIPPS - Vera Olive

1911 - PHIPPS - Winnie May


[Both Registered at Wellington. ]

Maybe check Births microfiche under PHIPPS (ideally the entries  should show that an alteration to surname has taken place ... with a number which usually indicates the year alteration was made.
e.g.   -----/17 (year: 1917)

    ~  Lu

Offline Lucy2

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 15,433
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: This branch of the RIDLER family has me confused.
« Reply #10 on: Sunday 05 March 17 22:53 GMT (UK) »
Hi Heather

Have some info to post soon regarding electoral listings for Sarah RIDLER (HOOKER), plus additional cemetery information, which in turn leads to the hunt for a man (with a very common "handle" ) who is taking a bit of "flushing out".   Will get back when I've sorted this out.

   ~  Lu

   

Offline hettyhen

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 270
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: This branch of the RIDLER family has me confused.
« Reply #11 on: Monday 06 March 17 01:22 GMT (UK) »
Lucy2,
Sorry my age subtraction was 10 years out, just to confuse things even more.
The first probate for Sarah RIDLER has a statement by Frederick William, her son, who says "she was married once only, and divorced in or about the year 1904". See that she is buried in the RC section of the Cemetery so maybe they didn't marry but just lived together. Have checked the E/R for Sarah GREY & William George GREY together 1928 only him 1935, but haven't managed to track either of them any further as yet, a few W.G. Greys to choose from. Will email the library and see if they will forward the death notice.
The "Truth" item of PHIPPS v PHIPPS says "no disturbance to the birth statistics had occurred from the union", but if he had deserted her=NZ Times Oct 2nd 1916 'desertion of her for five years and upwards" the children need not be his. The 1905-06 Newtown Wgtn E/R shows Mary Ann in Holloway Road Married and John at Te Aro Boarding House Tarankai St Wgtn Central. Haven't got Mary Ann after that, but John 1911 at Abel Smith St. Wgtn Central Occ. Labourer. No John in Wgtn but a John PHIPPS Labourer appears 1919 Ellesmere & 1928 South Canterbury, could be a completely different John though!
The fiche are at the Hastings library and have not done a fiche search as yet, but will head out there next week and learn a new skill.
Am looking forward to your next post.
Cheers
HeatherR
Lanarkshire=Robertson-Ross-Russell-Neilson.
Staffordshire= Harrison-Jackson-Round
London=Poswillo-Hyams-Karby-Dossett-Baram-Detloff-Hyman
Gibralter=Poswillo
Dorset= Attwooll-Read-Northover
Australia=Karby-Meyer

Offline Lucy2

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 15,433
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: This branch of the RIDLER family has me confused.
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 08 March 17 01:12 GMT (UK) »
Hi Heather

Just about to begin posting info for you (... and there's quite a lot) now that I've (hopefully) solved the mystery of Sarah.

   ~  Lu


Offline Lucy2

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 15,433
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: This branch of the RIDLER family has me confused.
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday 08 March 17 01:54 GMT (UK) »
Sarah RIDLER (nee HOOKER)  (+  William George GREY ) :
_______

As previously given, Sarah RIDLER (or Sarah Ester - or Esther RIDLER) died as Sarah GREY at Palmerston North on 5 April 1933.

She was buried as Sarah GREY on 7 April 1933 in the RC Section - Terrace End Cemetery, Palmerston North.

Her headstone reads :
" Sarah Ester GREY - died 5 April 1933 - aged 52 years.  R.I.P."

Another record from the cemetery reads :   
"RC - Block 11 - Plot 11  : Purchased by William George GREY, 26 Russell Street, Palmerston North on 6-4-1933" :

-------

And after a long process of weeding out the many others of the names "William George GREY (and GRAY)" have arrived at who I think this man was.   More of him later.

   ~  Lu
                                                                                      see next >>







Offline Lucy2

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 15,433
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: This branch of the RIDLER family has me confused.
« Reply #14 on: Wednesday 08 March 17 16:08 GMT (UK) »

Frederick George RIDLER born 1875- 22 Nov 1939, married in 1898 Sarah Esther HOOKER had a son Frederick William Thomas born 1899.They were divorced, Decree Nisi 8 Dec 1906. Sarah died 5 Apr 1933, but can’t find her birth, (could be anywhere) ....

Found Sarah's birth in New South Wales :

Births - AUS, NSW
1881

HOOKER - Sarah Easter [sic]
Father : Francis* HOOKER
Mother : Jane
Registered at :    Walcha, NSW


.... also born to same couple

HOOKER - Mary J. -- 1883 - reg'd. Armidale, NSW

HOOKER - William T. -- 1885 - reg'd. Liverpool, NSW

[Probable marriage of parents : March  1878 - Queensland
Francis HOOKER - Jane COOK ]   

[*  Francis HOOKER later becomes "Frederick".]
-----

After following up on a girl I thought might be Sarah's sister, found that Sarah's parents plus more of her siblings, had settled in the Manawatu region.
 
                                                                                  see next >>





Offline Lucy2

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 15,433
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: This branch of the RIDLER family has me confused.
« Reply #15 on: Wednesday 08 March 17 20:26 GMT (UK) »

The first probate for Sarah RIDLER has a statement by Frederick William, her son, who says "she was married once only, and divorced in or about the year 1904". See that she is buried in the RC section of the Cemetery so maybe they didn't marry but just lived together. Have checked the E/R for Sarah GREY & William George GREY together 1928 only him 1935, but haven't managed to track either of them any further as yet, a few W.G. Greys to choose from.


Yes, several W.G. GREY's to choose from  ;D ... and it took time to weed them out - using e/rolls, also directories (but in conjunction with e/rolls because they're not a terribly reliable resource as details weren't regularly updated).     

Sarah's son Frederick William is correct in saying his mother married only once (to RIDLER).  She certainly did not marry Mr. GREY (as he was still married until 1940's - more on this to follow.)

I can't find Sarah on e/rolls prior to 1922 (under any of her known surnames) ... but there is evidence that she was using the name "GREY" as far back as late 1920.

She is in Palmerston North from 1920 at least ... and  as "Sarah GREY - married" with William George GREY - agent, residing at 93 Broad Street, in the 1922 Palmerston roll.     Same listing for years 1925 (and 1928 and 1930) but living at  26 Russell Street  ... also at this address - same years - is Sarah's widowed mother, Jane HOOKER.   [Jane HOOKER in fact died at Palmerston Nth just a month before Sarah's death in 1933 - but is buried elsewhere. ]

William George GREY  appears to remain in P.Nth. until 1935 - thereafter returning to his family (1938) in Auckland.
-----

William George GREY ... there were a number of them, but to confuse the issue, two living in the Manawatu area.   [Was able to rule out the policeman of that name who had a wife Mary May.]
Annoyingly, the guy WG GREY who was with  Sarah, only ever had "agent" as his occupation.
In 1914 though, there are two e/roll listings at Napier and Palmerston for a William (agent) and May GREY c/- Albion Hotel, Napier ... and on the Palmerston supplementary roll for William George GREY - insurance agent, and May GREY, married, c/- Railway Hotel, Palm. Nth.   [I tend to think this WG GREY (1914) is the man, later with Sarah.   No idea who May GREY (cool name  :D) was, or where she went.

   ~  Lu                                                                     more to follow >>




Offline Lucy2

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 15,433
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: This branch of the RIDLER family has me confused.
« Reply #16 on: Wednesday 08 March 17 20:37 GMT (UK) »
Link to the Will of Jane HOOKER (Sarah's mother) : 

The Will is dated > 6 May 1921 > ... but wasn't probated until 1946 !!  (Explanation for delay is provided by a daughter.)

Jane's children are all mentioned - including >

Sarah Ester HOOKER - Broad Street, Palmerston North

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-897J-V2PS?mode=g&i=61&cc=1865481

                                                                                                see next  >>

Offline Lucy2

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 15,433
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: This branch of the RIDLER family has me confused.
« Reply #17 on: Wednesday 08 March 17 20:52 GMT (UK) »
Sarah ... mentioned in her father's 1920 obituary as " Mrs W. GRAY of Palmerston N."

http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/MH19201221.2.8
[Obit:  Mr F. HOOKER - link found in "tree" of a Hooker family researcher. ]

                                                                                                       see next  >>