Author Topic: William Houlder (b.1790) of Southwark - Transportation Mystery - Seeking Opinion  (Read 2044 times)

Offline Jomot

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Re: William Houlder (b.1790) of Southwark - Transportation Mystery - Seeking Opinion
« Reply #9 on: Tuesday 28 March 17 20:44 BST (UK) »
Onto Australian records. My cousin and I have confirmed that the William Houlder in Tasmania was released at 4 years 8 mo on good behavior.

Did you look at the 1867 Hobart death I suggested? 
MORGAN: Glamorgan, Durham, Ohio. DAVIS/DAVIES/DAVID: Glamorgan, Ohio.  GIBSON: Leicestershire, Durham, North Yorkshire.  RAIN/RAINE: Cumberland.  TAYLOR: North Yorks. BOURDAS: North Yorks. JEFFREYS: Worcestershire & Northumberland. FORBES: Berwickshire, CHEESMOND: Durham/Northumberland. WINTER: Durham/Northumberland. SNOWBALL: Durham.

Offline hanes teulu

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Re: William Houlder (b.1790) of Southwark - Transportation Mystery - Seeking Opinion
« Reply #10 on: Tuesday 28 March 17 20:50 BST (UK) »
London Gazette
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/19965/page/880

See Houlder col 1 (abt half way down)

(Click on previous page for "Reason for Petition).

Is this "your" William?

Offline caitcarl

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Re: William Houlder (b.1790) of Southwark - Transportation Mystery - Seeking Opinion
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 29 March 17 00:10 BST (UK) »
Hi All,

Current progress... Jomot, I did manage to find the digital copy of the Tasmanian death record after I got out of work and home. Thank you for pointing me in that direction, I'm sorry that I appeared to overlook your original post about that!

I also found an article from 1874 describing the Brickfields Depot (Mercury (Hobart, Tas. : 1860 - 1954), Saturday 30 May 1874, page 2), and it indicates that many of the inmates were "at one portion of their careers, made acquaintance with a different kind of institution." It also suggests elsewhere that many were former convicts sent from England. Certainly seems to fit. I'm not thrown off by the age being wrong, as who knows what his state of mind was at the time he gave his age.

Looks like we could be getting closer to figuring this all out.

hanes teulu, I am intrigued by that London Gazette article. Some of those addresses seem plausible, but I will have to investigate some of the others! Thank you!!
Houlder - London area
Jennings - London area
Ellis - London area

Offline Jomot

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Re: William Houlder (b.1790) of Southwark - Transportation Mystery - Seeking Opinion
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 29 March 17 00:59 BST (UK) »
Jomot, I did manage to find the digital copy of the Tasmanian death record after I got out of work and home. Thank you for pointing me in that direction, I'm sorry that I appeared to overlook your original post about that!

I was more concerned you simply hadn't seen it. 

Reading the various articles about William Houlder's escapades in Tasmania it seems he was made bankrupt in 1856 and again in 1859, shortly after a court case in which he was described as nearly 70 and 'in debt and not worth a farthing'.  It therefore seems increasingly likely that the London Gazette article relates to him, as well as the burial as a pauper.
MORGAN: Glamorgan, Durham, Ohio. DAVIS/DAVIES/DAVID: Glamorgan, Ohio.  GIBSON: Leicestershire, Durham, North Yorkshire.  RAIN/RAINE: Cumberland.  TAYLOR: North Yorks. BOURDAS: North Yorks. JEFFREYS: Worcestershire & Northumberland. FORBES: Berwickshire, CHEESMOND: Durham/Northumberland. WINTER: Durham/Northumberland. SNOWBALL: Durham.


Offline Jomot

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Re: William Houlder (b.1790) of Southwark - Transportation Mystery - Seeking Opinion
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday 29 March 17 02:13 BST (UK) »
Just following up on the London Gazette article, there is a notice in the Sussex Advertiser dated 14 Mar 1831 regarding a James Harmer of Hurstpierpoint, Plumber, Painter & Glazier having assigned all his stock, book debts etc  to George Alfred Musket of Snow’s Field, Southwark, Oil & Lead Merchant, and William Houlder of Dover Road, Borough, London, Lead & Glass Merchant.   

Another notice in Perry's Bankrupt Gazette dated 21 May 1831 advising that the partnership of William Houlder and William Mackenzie of Swan Street & Borough Market, Borough, had been dissolved.

Also this in 1835: https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/19269/page/935  (bottom left)

In January 1840 a William Houlder of Church Street, Southwark, Glass and Lead Merchant petitioned for the bankruptcy of John Collins of Staines, Middlesex. 

Taken together they all fit well with the William Houlder from 1841

Also a little more on the 1844 embezzlement case.  Several articles have reported it under the name William Holder and described him as “a well dressed man, and said to be respectably connected”.  He had been employed by Flockton & Co, Tar & Turpentine distillers of Bermondsey for 12 months as a traveller & collector, and was supposed to hand over any money he had collected the following day, however, it was discovered that various sums had not been accounted for and had instead been ‘converted for his own purposes’.
MORGAN: Glamorgan, Durham, Ohio. DAVIS/DAVIES/DAVID: Glamorgan, Ohio.  GIBSON: Leicestershire, Durham, North Yorkshire.  RAIN/RAINE: Cumberland.  TAYLOR: North Yorks. BOURDAS: North Yorks. JEFFREYS: Worcestershire & Northumberland. FORBES: Berwickshire, CHEESMOND: Durham/Northumberland. WINTER: Durham/Northumberland. SNOWBALL: Durham.

Offline caitcarl

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Re: William Houlder (b.1790) of Southwark - Transportation Mystery - Seeking Opinion
« Reply #14 on: Wednesday 29 March 17 12:16 BST (UK) »
Jomot, thank you so much for continuing to help paint the picture.

Just to confirm, this the article you referenced of a William Houlder in Hobart at age 70: http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/3255933?searchTerm=%22William%20Houlder%22&searchLimits=l-availability=y|||l-decade=185

I agree that the pre-1844 cases all seem to fit quite well. The book where we got some of the initial information that made us scratch our heads, described William Houlder as a man who "enjoyed good living and bad gambling," and inferred that he enjoyed the finer things in life. It wouldn't surprise me if he had himself well dressed and well connected. Hmmm...
Houlder - London area
Jennings - London area
Ellis - London area

Offline hanes teulu

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Re: William Houlder (b.1790) of Southwark - Transportation Mystery - Seeking Opinion
« Reply #15 on: Wednesday 29 March 17 13:13 BST (UK) »
William Houlder, Agent, age 53, height 5' 7", bald grey (hair), fresh (complexion), grey (eyes), offence embezzlement was received at Millbank prison on 1 Mar 1844 from Newgate gaol. On 19 April 1844 he was removed to the convict ship Maria Somes.

The Maria Somes sailed 25 April 1844 arriving VDL 30 July 1844.

Offline Jomot

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Re: William Houlder (b.1790) of Southwark - Transportation Mystery - Seeking Opinion
« Reply #16 on: Wednesday 29 March 17 13:40 BST (UK) »
Hi Caitcarl, yes, that was the article.

If you have access to Ancestry you should also find him on quite a few of the Land records, although the record set "Surrey, England, Jury-Qualified Freeholders and Copyholders" seems particularly interesting as for the years 1820-1824 William Houlder is recorded at the following locations:

Borough Market - Glazier
Dover Road - Glasscutter
Dover Road - Plumber
Suffolk Street - Painter & Glazier

Jury service was only open to men of a certain status, so that would certainly suggest he would have been reasonably 'well connected'.  I'm sure others can tell you more about this, and those specific records - some of which have numbers suffixed to them - but this is helpful as a general overview: http://www.rootschat.com/links/01jtm/

However, there are also some land tax entries from before he was born which presumably are his father, who you mention died in 1807.
MORGAN: Glamorgan, Durham, Ohio. DAVIS/DAVIES/DAVID: Glamorgan, Ohio.  GIBSON: Leicestershire, Durham, North Yorkshire.  RAIN/RAINE: Cumberland.  TAYLOR: North Yorks. BOURDAS: North Yorks. JEFFREYS: Worcestershire & Northumberland. FORBES: Berwickshire, CHEESMOND: Durham/Northumberland. WINTER: Durham/Northumberland. SNOWBALL: Durham.

Offline hanes teulu

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Re: William Houlder (b.1790) of Southwark - Transportation Mystery - Seeking Opinion
« Reply #17 on: Wednesday 29 March 17 13:46 BST (UK) »
The Launceston Chronicle, 14 Jun 1848 has an item about a "William Houlder, Maria Somes" being recommended for a conditional pardon.

The Courier (Hobart), 2 Jun 1849 has an item about " ... William Houlder, ticket-of-leave, my late clerk ..." where his former employer is instructing the public not to pay money or give credit to William.