Author Topic: Ambrose Jabez Sandoz Otheneret  (Read 782 times)

Offline odbsmith

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 97
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Ambrose Jabez Sandoz Otheneret
« on: Saturday 15 April 17 22:37 BST (UK) »
Ambrose Jabez Sandoz Otheneret, born 3rd quarter 1858 in Birmingham.
I can find no other record for him. ( no havent ordered certificate yet)
The information I have from a shared tree of the Sandoz Otheneret is that his parents were Emile ans Susanna, and he died in  1930. Does anyone have suggestions?
Hudman, Souch, Grinyer, King, Nightingale, Sandoz, Gateley, Findley

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline Milliepede

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 7,988
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Ambrose Jabez Sandoz Otheneret
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 15 April 17 22:45 BST (UK) »
Birth register for Ambrose Jabez Sandoz Sep 1858 Birmingham gives mothers maiden name Treeherne if that's any help.
Hinchliffe Huddersfield Wiltshire

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline CaroleW

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 54,100
  • Barney 1993-2004
    • View Profile
Re: Ambrose Jabez Sandoz Otheneret
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 15 April 17 22:46 BST (UK) »
His birth reg has his surname as Sandoz

His mothers maiden name is shown as Treeherne as per GRO online search

https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/indexes_search.asp
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline CaroleW

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 54,100
  • Barney 1993-2004
    • View Profile
Re: Ambrose Jabez Sandoz Otheneret
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 15 April 17 22:56 BST (UK) »
Family Search

Emile Sandoz Otheneret Dec qtr 1852 Aston 6D 414
   
Susanna Treherne on same page

Quote
and he died in  1930.

Where?
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Online Manchester Rambler

  • Global Moderator
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • ********
  • Posts: 6,431
    • View Profile
    • angloswiss.net
Re: Ambrose Jabez Sandoz Otheneret
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 15 April 17 23:03 BST (UK) »
The Sandoz-Otheneret family is a branch of the Sandoz family from the canton of Neuchâtel in Switzerland. (The last part of the surname wasn't always used - in Neuchâtel it was needed to distinguish between the numerous local branches of the family.)

The GRO online index gives Ambrose's mother's maiden name as TREEHERNE - this seems to correspond with the family from the online tree, but I can't see Ambrose on censuses with them. :/

If this is the correct family, Emile was born in Le Locle in about 1813, and married Susanna Treherne in Aston registration district in 1852.

I'll have a dig in our Neuchâtel records, and see if I can find a likely candidate.

Added:  According to assorted online trees, Ambrose's paternal grandparents were Julien Sandoz(-Otheneret) and Marianne Matthey - I have their marriage in Le Locle in 1803, and can probably trace them backwards to some extent.  However, you really need to confirm Ambrose's parents (from the birth cert) and his grandfather (from his parents' marriage cert).
ANT: Nesbit, Potts; CHS: Gosling (Hazel Grove/Lymm), Hinton (Lymm), Johnson (Hazel Grove), Marsland (Hazel Grove), Massey (Daresbury), Sorton (Warmingham); LAN: Jackson, James, Potts (Manchester/Salford); MAY: Caulfield, Griffin (Leveelick); SAL: Goodwin, Johnson (Bridgnorth), Gregory (Wellington); STS: Goodwin, Gregory, Johnson (Wolverhampton); Hallett (Trysull); SOM: Dowding, James, Jones (Bath)

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline odbsmith

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 97
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Ambrose Jabez Sandoz Otheneret
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 16 April 17 09:35 BST (UK) »
Hi everyone, I know that Emile and Sussana (Treherne) are more than likely parents as there were no other "Sandoz" in Birmingham. I know that sometimes Otheneret  was dropped. The tree I have on pdf goes back to the 14th century, but doesnt help with Ambrose's place of death. I have considered this puzzle many times and have come back to it again. He does not appear in the 1861 census  with his family and he would be just 3 years old.  If he had died before then it would explain no census records, and the death in 1930 maybe an error?
Hudman, Souch, Grinyer, King, Nightingale, Sandoz, Gateley, Findley

Offline Milliepede

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 7,988
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Ambrose Jabez Sandoz Otheneret
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 16 April 17 12:13 BST (UK) »
Could he be under a different name on census - is there a little boy about his age on the 1861? **

Any evidence for the 1930 death?

The only Sandoz Birmingham 1858-1861 is Edwin age 1 but that was after 1861 census  :(

** no I see there isn't.  Any other family around he could be with like grandparents.
Hinchliffe Huddersfield Wiltshire

Offline odbsmith

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 97
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Ambrose Jabez Sandoz Otheneret
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 16 April 17 19:35 BST (UK) »
Sussana's parents were dead by this time.
I have done a quick check using Ancestry and he is not with his mothers siblings on 1861 census.
This is a complex family. When Emile (1814 -1894) left Swizerland  he had a family. I have no idea what happened and wether they were divorced or what.
It is believed Emile had a relationship with Ellen Magdeline Treherne and had 3 sons with her , but married Ellens sister Susanna and had  a family with her.
Having had a good look at the tree I was given I believe the person that compiled it made a mistake. Ambrose is given as b 1858, m to Elizabeth Catherine Davies, d 1930.
Edwin is given as b1860 d1861. But there are records fo Edwin B1860 m to Eliz. C Davies and d 1930
But that still leaves me with no other records for Ambrose.
Hudman, Souch, Grinyer, King, Nightingale, Sandoz, Gateley, Findley

Offline Milliepede

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 7,988
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Ambrose Jabez Sandoz Otheneret
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 16 April 17 22:35 BST (UK) »
Yes the marriage to Elizabeth Catherine Davies in 1892 has Edwin so he can't be the Edwin who died in 1861. 

As you say that still leaves no records for Ambrose and 2 conflicting records for Edwin  :-\

Death for Edwin 1930 is age 71 so born c1859.  Who died in 1861.  Could it be Ambrose misnamed and away from home in 1861 perhaps sickly.  Bit far fetched but stranger things have happened!

Where is Ellen Magdeline in 1861?
Hinchliffe Huddersfield Wiltshire