Author Topic: Marchioness Mail Ship-Melbourne to Nelson to Wellington Passengers Help Please  (Read 10016 times)

Offline minniehaha

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Re: Marchioness Mail Ship-Melbourne to Nelson to Wellington Passengers Help Please
« Reply #63 on: Tuesday 03 July 18 23:15 BST (UK) »
Part quote from response above......

"I am lost as to what the politics/societal environment of 1921 was, that allowed Michael's death certificate to fail to record his parents names (and hence a concrete connection to Mary & Patrick). Was he a cousin maybe (masquerading as a son for immigration purposes in 1858)  - Or was it just a lazy/busy undertaker?"


Even today there are deaths registered without details of parentage and indeed other information can also be missing. The details provided at this time are only as good as the knowledge of the person supplying them. If there are gaps in what they know, this will result in empty spaces (or "not known") on the printout/certificate. It should also be noted that even the information provided may not necessarily be accurate.......


Minniehaha.
HAMMOND, Cainham/Caynham, Shropshire, U.K. Otago-NZ.
GALBRAITH, Ireland, Dunedin, Otago-NZ., Kensington-London, U.K.
GRANT, Sct., Dunedin, Otago-NZ., Vancouver, Canada.
GLASS, Aberdeenshire, Otago-NZ.
CAIRNEY/CARNEY/KEARNEY/Ireland, Airdrie, Scotland, Otago-NZ.
O'BRIEN Mary Ann, Limerick, Otago-NZ.
NICOL(L) James, Scotland, Otago-NZ.
SCOTT Thomas, Shetland, Otago-NZ.
MCHARDY/MCHARDIE Euphemia, Scotland, Otago-NZ.

Offline marsbar60

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Re: Marchioness Mail Ship-Melbourne to Nelson to Wellington Passengers Help Please
« Reply #64 on: Sunday 03 February 19 03:28 GMT (UK) »
Hi Peter, lots of questions to answer here and I am very interested in carrying on this thread so I can fill out more of our family tree, and we can help each other fill in the missing pieces.

I don’t know the exact location of the farmhouse where Thomas Maher Jnr lived in Takapu Porirua but I have photos of it and Thomas and his Buick, from when my great grandfather visited him in 1932.

I have made a circular tree of all the members of the Maher/Meagher family that I have found so far including birth and death dates etc. Patrick and Mary are at the centre of the tree, it is in PDF format so will I see if I can send it to you via a PM.

I have found local members of John Maher and Avis Dunstan’s family near where I live, so I will finish their section of the tree as I get time. John Maher was the policeman for Taumarunui starting 16th Dec 1903.

Of course this is from Thomas Meagher Senior’s side the tree, Catherine’s (his sister) part of the tree is still completely blank at this stage.

I also have four photos mentioning Ngaio and Khandallah and photos of a place called “The Moorings” (taken in 1924 and 1926), where my great grandfather (James) and grandmother (Emily) used to visit regularly. I would really like to know who they were visiting there.

I have been away for six months doing a bicycle tour of England, Ireland and Western Europe. I cycled up to Graystown – Co Tippery from Fethard where I was staying in Ireland, which is where Patrick and Mary lived when Michael and Thomas were born . I also spent a couple of hours in Killenaule with an historian who emailed me the following:

(Start of email from Killenaule historian)

Marriage of Patrick Meagher and Mary Dwyer

Two possible entries for this

1st December 1838 between Pat Maher and Mary Dwyer (Boreheen) and

24th February 1840 between Patt Maher (Tullarone) and  Mary Dwyer (Boreheen).

I would guess the first is the correct one as the second takes place after the birth of Tom Maher but I'll give you both just in case.

See photo's pat_mary_marriage_1838_or_1840, pat_mary_marriage_1838_orig and pat_mary_marriage_1840_orig.


Children of Patrick Meagher and Mary Dwyer.


There was no sign of any children called either Richard or Mary with Patrick/Mary as parents so I can't shed any light on the identity of the couple. The following are the baptism dates for the other children.

Tom - 8th February 1840
Michael - 29th Sept 1841
Catherine - 3rd March 1844
James - 5th May 1846
John - 22nd Jan 1849
Judith - 14th March 1852.

Photo's from the Index and the original entry for all the above are on the drive.

 

Possible Parents of Patrick Meagher

I checked the records for any Patrick Meagher or Maher born in 1814 and found one

Patt Maher bapt 24th Feb 1814.  Father William Maher, Mother Julia Manning (see photos patt_maher_bapt1 and patt_maher_bapt1_orig)

No other children with seemingly the same parents however there was a Judith Maher born in 1816 to a William Maher and a Judith Hannin (see judith_maher_bapt_1816_orig), I wouldn't be surprised if Manning and Hannin are the same woman.

There's a couple of other Patrick Mahers born in the surrounding years in 1801 (see  patt_maher_bapt1) and 1816 (see  pat_maher_bapt2 and pat_maher_bapt2_original).

Of course your Pat Maher may only have come to the Parish later on in life so wasn't baptised here.


Parents of Mary Dwyer

A bit more luck with Mary's parents. From her death cert we get the names Maurice Dwyer and Johanna Dee and there are a number of entries for these two in the Baptism records.

There's no sign of Mary's baptism in 1807 (or any other year) but we do have some possible siblings.

James born 1815 (mother listed as Jude Dea)
Bridget born 1816  (mother listed as Joanna Dea)
John born 1819  (mother listed as Joanna Dee)
Catherine born 1834  (mother listed as Jude Dee)

The names James, John and Catherine are of course repeated in the next generation.

The family's location (Boreheen) for the baptism of Catherine is the same as listed for Mary in (both of) the Marriage listings mentioned above.

I forgot to check if  there was a marriage entry for Maurice and Johanna listed but given there's no baptism record for Mary It's possible they were already married and had at least one child before moving to the Parish. I will check the Marriage listings next time I'm looking.

(End of email from Killenaule historian)

Offline shanreagh

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Re: Marchioness Mail Ship-Melbourne to Nelson to Wellington Passengers Help Please
« Reply #65 on: Sunday 03 February 19 10:25 GMT (UK) »
The Moorings is the name of an historic house in Thorndon
http://www.wellingtoncityheritage.org.nz/buildings/1-150/134-the-moorings

http://www.wellingtoncityheritage.org.nz/buildings/1-150/134-the-moorings

May have been visiting JS Swan who owned/lived 1905 -1936 in the house after designing and having it built.  He was an architect. 

Offline marsbar60

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Re: Marchioness Mail Ship-Melbourne to Nelson to Wellington Passengers Help Please
« Reply #66 on: Monday 04 February 19 02:07 GMT (UK) »
The Moorings in Thorndon is very different. I have put a link in below of the photos of the "Moorings" in Ngaio, one in 1924 without a garage and one in 1926 with a garage, hopefully they can be viewed, I made the album public. There are also four others, one has Emily my great grandmother and Ralph my Grandfather together in the 50s.
Any help about the location would be appreciated as there are is no address on the back of the photo.
It is taken by Ralph's older brother Richard and he always referred to Emily as "The Mother"

https://www.flickr.com/photos/128769929@N02/40012097763/in/album-72157683718979435/


Offline minniehaha

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HAMMOND, Cainham/Caynham, Shropshire, U.K. Otago-NZ.
GALBRAITH, Ireland, Dunedin, Otago-NZ., Kensington-London, U.K.
GRANT, Sct., Dunedin, Otago-NZ., Vancouver, Canada.
GLASS, Aberdeenshire, Otago-NZ.
CAIRNEY/CARNEY/KEARNEY/Ireland, Airdrie, Scotland, Otago-NZ.
O'BRIEN Mary Ann, Limerick, Otago-NZ.
NICOL(L) James, Scotland, Otago-NZ.
SCOTT Thomas, Shetland, Otago-NZ.
MCHARDY/MCHARDIE Euphemia, Scotland, Otago-NZ.

Offline marsbar60

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Re: Marchioness Mail Ship-Melbourne to Nelson to Wellington Passengers Help Please
« Reply #68 on: Monday 04 February 19 03:52 GMT (UK) »
Thanks. It doesn't look like the road or the house in my photo, were you able to follow the photo link? I might do some street surfing on Google Maps

Offline shanreagh

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Re: Marchioness Mail Ship-Melbourne to Nelson to Wellington Passengers Help Please
« Reply #69 on: Monday 04 February 19 22:54 GMT (UK) »
I just did a Google search and find these same images but with a date in the 1920s.  So are we looking around then? Meaning house may have been known as The Moorings in the 1920s.  Obviously the house is older. WCC has archives that may be worth exploring.

Offline Peter Clapcott

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Re: Marchioness Mail Ship-Melbourne to Nelson to Wellington Passengers Help Please
« Reply #70 on: Friday 15 March 19 05:56 GMT (UK) »
Hi Peter, lots of questions to answer here and I am very interested in carrying on this thread so I can fill out more of our family tree, and we can help each other fill in the missing pieces.

All good stuff, thanks.
Thanks for the photos ... I see what you mean by "tall" ....

Re Catherine Meagher (1843-1895) and Ngaio.
Catherine married (1866) John Casey (1843-1879)

"Caseys Farm" was in Ngaio/Crofton and supplied milk to the wider area.
As you have referred to the Cyclopedia of NZ you will find a bio of John (John and Catherines son). The mother referred to is Catherine.
http://nzetc.victoria.ac.nz/tm/scholarly/tei-Cyc01Cycl-t1-body-d4-d107-d4.html#name-415093-mention

(I descend from Catherines daughter Mary Angelina (1867-1937)  m (1891) John McDonnell (1866-1937)

The house photos looks like a number of settings in the Wellington area (House in the crook of a tight descending valley road). The presence of houses above on the crest of the hill is significant. I will go for a drive ....

The body for research information in this area is the "Onslow Historical Society". I have been meaning to delve into their records....

As an aside The Moorings, Thorndon is in Glenbervie Terrace.
Probably coincidental speculation. However Hannah and Edgar Biddle lived in Glenbervie Terrace before they moved to Murphy Street around 1900. On Hannahs death, her property was granted to her daughter Agnes, who is noted living in Murphy Street. This does not preclude that another plot of land was still owned.

   
 

Offline marsbar60

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Re: Marchioness Mail Ship-Melbourne to Nelson to Wellington Passengers Help Please
« Reply #71 on: Sunday 17 March 19 01:09 GMT (UK) »
Thank you Peter, you have done some some great research on the Wellington members of Patrick and Mary's family, I will put that information in Catherine's branch of the Tree. I have sent you a private message in case you would like my details (Rootschat - My Messages). I would like to spend a few days in Wellington at some stage doing more research especially on Thomas Senior's family (Thomas Junior was his first son). From Papers past I have been able to see that Michael, Thomas and James (Meagher/Maher) were working for W.B. Rhodes at his property the Grange on Wadestown Road after Patrick's (their father) death, but I would like to find out more about that and their early Porirua life. Also not sure what happened to James yet.