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Author Topic: First Cousin mystery.  (Read 1787 times)

Offline wrjones

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First Cousin mystery.
« on: Monday 12 June 17 22:46 BST (UK) »
This really is a bit of an old chestnut for me!However new info has come to light today.My relative Margaret Jane Griffiths was born in Rhosymedre Denbighshire in 1900.She was to marry a John L Watkin in 1920.Another person,an Elsie May Williams was to marry an Idris Lewis in 1928.

I was told by the Watkin's daughter today that Margaret Jane Griffiths and Elsie May Williams were First Cousins.

I very much welcome any help in proving the two people were First Cousin's please?

Regards
William Russell Jones.
Jones, Griffiths. Stephens, Parry, Gabriel, Conway, Hughes, Evans, Roberts, Lea, Hanmer. Peake, Edwards. Newnes, Davies. Thomas. "Blythin".
All North Wales.
Conway, Durber, Cartlidge, Lovatt, Bebington. Brindley, Sankey, Brunt. Dean. Clewes. Rhodes. Mountford,Walker,Bache, "Gibbons"Hood. Taylor
All Stoke-on-Trent.
Francis - Nantwich Cheshire.
Dennell - Cheshire/Staffordshire.
Talbot-Shropshire
Census Information Is Crown Copyright,from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline avm228

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Re: First Cousin mystery.
« Reply #1 on: Monday 12 June 17 22:50 BST (UK) »
Do you know the identity of the parents of Margaret or Elsie?
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline avm228

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Re: First Cousin mystery.
« Reply #2 on: Monday 12 June 17 22:55 BST (UK) »
This birth reg?

Margaret Jane Griffiths mmn Gabriel, Mar qtr 1900 Wrexham

Her parents were William & Ann per 1901.

So: marriage of William Griffiths & Annie Gabriel, Jun qtr 1875 Wrexham.
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline wrjones

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Re: First Cousin mystery.
« Reply #3 on: Monday 12 June 17 23:00 BST (UK) »
The parents of Margaret Jane Griffiths were a William Griffiths born in Cefn Mawr Denbighshire in c 1850 and an Ann Gabriel born in Llangollen Denbighshire in 1858.The parents of Elsie May Williams are less obvious to find.

Regards
William Russell Jones.
Jones, Griffiths. Stephens, Parry, Gabriel, Conway, Hughes, Evans, Roberts, Lea, Hanmer. Peake, Edwards. Newnes, Davies. Thomas. "Blythin".
All North Wales.
Conway, Durber, Cartlidge, Lovatt, Bebington. Brindley, Sankey, Brunt. Dean. Clewes. Rhodes. Mountford,Walker,Bache, "Gibbons"Hood. Taylor
All Stoke-on-Trent.
Francis - Nantwich Cheshire.
Dennell - Cheshire/Staffordshire.
Talbot-Shropshire
Census Information Is Crown Copyright,from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline wrjones

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Re: First Cousin mystery.
« Reply #4 on: Monday 12 June 17 23:01 BST (UK) »
Quote from: avm228 on Monday 12 June 17 22:55 BST (UK)
This birth reg?

Margaret Jane Griffiths mmn Gabriel, Mar qtr 1900 Wrexham

Yes that is correct.

Regards
William Russell Jones
Jones, Griffiths. Stephens, Parry, Gabriel, Conway, Hughes, Evans, Roberts, Lea, Hanmer. Peake, Edwards. Newnes, Davies. Thomas. "Blythin".
All North Wales.
Conway, Durber, Cartlidge, Lovatt, Bebington. Brindley, Sankey, Brunt. Dean. Clewes. Rhodes. Mountford,Walker,Bache, "Gibbons"Hood. Taylor
All Stoke-on-Trent.
Francis - Nantwich Cheshire.
Dennell - Cheshire/Staffordshire.
Talbot-Shropshire
Census Information Is Crown Copyright,from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline avm228

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Re: First Cousin mystery.
« Reply #5 on: Monday 12 June 17 23:07 BST (UK) »
Possible birth registrations:

Elsie May Williams mmn Hughes, Jun qtr 1908 Wrexham
Elsie May Williams mmn Griffiths, Sep qtr 1908 Wrexham
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline wrjones

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Re: First Cousin mystery.
« Reply #6 on: Monday 12 June 17 23:13 BST (UK) »
Quote from: avm228 on Monday 12 June 17 23:07 BST (UK)
Possible birth registrations:

Elsie May Williams mmn Hughes, Jun qtr 1908 Wrexham
Elsie May Williams mmn Griffiths, Sep qtr 1908 Wrexham

Elsie May Lewis' death in 1995 gives her Birthdate as 15/05/1908.

Regards
William Russell Jones.
Jones, Griffiths. Stephens, Parry, Gabriel, Conway, Hughes, Evans, Roberts, Lea, Hanmer. Peake, Edwards. Newnes, Davies. Thomas. "Blythin".
All North Wales.
Conway, Durber, Cartlidge, Lovatt, Bebington. Brindley, Sankey, Brunt. Dean. Clewes. Rhodes. Mountford,Walker,Bache, "Gibbons"Hood. Taylor
All Stoke-on-Trent.
Francis - Nantwich Cheshire.
Dennell - Cheshire/Staffordshire.
Talbot-Shropshire
Census Information Is Crown Copyright,from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline wrjones

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Re: First Cousin mystery.
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 14 June 17 08:22 BST (UK) »
Quote from: wrjones on Monday 12 June 17 23:13 BST (UK)
Quote from: avm228 on Monday 12 June 17 23:07 BST (UK)
Possible birth registrations:

Elsie May Williams mmn Hughes, Jun qtr 1908 Wrexham
Elsie May Williams mmn Griffiths, Sep qtr 1908 Wrexham

Elsie May Lewis' death in 1995 gives her Birthdate as 15/05/1908.

Regards
William Russell Jones.

Given the death info and the likely birth in the June Quarter of 1908,it seems that the purchase of the Birth Certificate is an absolute necessity in this case.I'll be in contact with the registrar at Wrexham very shortly.

Regards
William Russell Jones.
Jones, Griffiths. Stephens, Parry, Gabriel, Conway, Hughes, Evans, Roberts, Lea, Hanmer. Peake, Edwards. Newnes, Davies. Thomas. "Blythin".
All North Wales.
Conway, Durber, Cartlidge, Lovatt, Bebington. Brindley, Sankey, Brunt. Dean. Clewes. Rhodes. Mountford,Walker,Bache, "Gibbons"Hood. Taylor
All Stoke-on-Trent.
Francis - Nantwich Cheshire.
Dennell - Cheshire/Staffordshire.
Talbot-Shropshire
Census Information Is Crown Copyright,from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline despair

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Re: First Cousin mystery.
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 14 June 17 09:12 BST (UK) »
In checking the 1939 register the birth data you have is consistent with the record there.I think the "other" Elsie is there too,under a married name she acquired later.She is transcribed with a birthdate of 29th Jan 1908,but I'm sure the original says 29th Jun,making it likely she is the Sept. quarter registered birth.
I did wonder,if the "first cousin"relationship is not obvious,whether they may be "once removed".

Regards
Roger
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