The Rev.Bertram Joseph Ellis

[toby webb]

Up to 1911, apart from Bertram, I have nearly everything about Joseph, wife & family. Joseph, being a frequent Christian name presents difficulty for a death date. There are many possibilities but it now seems likely to have been in C.Sodbury and RC too. Roman Catholic comes as no surprise as J. & Agnes were married at RC church in Derby and there is a good sprinkling of RC elsewhere in the family. This is a problem in itself for RC records are not easily available. T

[Capetown]

FindmyPast has the Electoral Roll Register 1832-1932 - so may be pre 1928 - Bertram's abode could be found

[toby webb]

      Findmypast could well be helpful, but that will have to wait for another day.
      Meanwhile his non-appearance in 1911 census puzzles me.
In 1911, he would have been 21 and so might have been expected to be involved in some sort of training.If he was in the process of taking holy orders (RC), where might he have been expected to be found? Would he have been given a special name in a seminary or initials like in an asylum? There is also the possibility that he was a soldier in 1911 and later had a 'calling'. Any ideas? T

[Capetown]

Many GWR and other regions (workers) - went all over the world to work

May be the whole family went to work abroad after 1901

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Will have a look - but for starters

?  There is a tree on Ancestry for this family which gives

Birth of Sister Adelaide Mary FLORENCE 1879-1914, born Swindon Wiltshire


* on the 1911 census at Statton St Margaret, Wiltshire aged 25 and a Servant


and her death

20 July 1914, Dover, Kent, Delaware USA


Adelaide married James Patrick Moore at St Paul's Dover  Kent  25 December 1904


Their children listed from 1905 to 1912 - but can't see these on the UK census


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This one can be eliminated


Ancestry has

British Army WW1 Medal Cards given 20 February 1919

Bertram (which is hand written) J. ELLIS

Notts & Derby (Sherwood Foresters)

Pte:

Reg. No. 12362

Served in France 29 November 1914


Looking at the Sherwood Foresters website : this is Bertram Jennings Ellis

[toby webb]

Thank you for your efforts Capetown.
Moore family. Yes another whose 1911 eludes me.
Certainly Adelaide Mary Florence born 12 March 1979 was the sister of Joseph Ellis. She did indeed marry James Moore as you say. I had her death as Q3 1914 ( where does 20 July come from?)
aged 38 in Dover, Kent, but wonder where Delaware  USA comes from! Some of that Ellis family went to America but ? Moores. T

[Capetown]

On Ancestry : Public Members tree

JamesMoore567  (who last signed in yesterday)

is a copy of Adelaide's Death Certificate - very fuzzy to read - but can see the date 20 July 1914 and think her husband is a Draper's Porter

Also has scanned Adelaide's birth certificate - again fuzzy (assume Ancestry policy)


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I can see on Family Search : daughter Cicilia (as spelt) MOORE aged 3 on the 1911/Denis MOORE c 1909 /Roda etc Census Dover Kent, but so far Ancestry seems a problem.

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Found them on Ancestry (transcribed as MOON) - can understand why by the handwriting it could so easily be MOON

7 Widrid Road, Dover Kent


MOORE

James - 28 Draper's Porter, born Dover, Kent
Adelaide - 30 - married 6 years 4 children born 4 living  (born Swindon, Wiltshire)
Roda - 5
Cicilia - 3
Denis - 1
Patrick  (who died in 1912)

[toby webb]

Thanks for MOON. One less of the disappeared. T

[toby webb]

I have been looking more closely at some of the family trees associated with Moore. Clearly there is a lot of blind copying without thought being given to what is presented. Dover, Kent, Delaware USA is a good example. Such errors and similar make  me very cautious about what I see presented as fact.
A death on 20 March 1914  of Florence Bowman! Wrong person. Marriage in 1904. Wrong person. In both cases Adelade Mary Florence nee Ellis was involved. If  James Moore remarried after her death, I need some facts. More care needs to be taken!
Need I say'MOORE'! T