Author Topic: Another shove in the right direction  (Read 5397 times)

Offline Galium

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Re: Another shove in the right direction
« Reply #18 on: Sunday 09 July 17 18:28 BST (UK) »
Sorry, probably not Gascoigne Leopold.

Fanny, Alfred Frederick, Frank, Lilian, Elsie Theodora  and Gascoigne all found their way to New Zealand.   Gascoigne left from Southampton on 16 June 1921.
UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Mabel Bagshawe

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Re: Another shove in the right direction
« Reply #19 on: Sunday 09 July 17 19:03 BST (UK) »
Gascoigne served in WWI - he's on medal rolls as Gascoyne Leopold Sheeter of the Royal Army Service Corps

Might also be worth noting that his address when he migrates is in Llandudno

Online jim1

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Re: Another shove in the right direction
« Reply #20 on: Sunday 09 July 17 19:32 BST (UK) »
The only info. about him is mainly from himself. Born c. 1895 & father is Alfred Shuter a carpenter this according to his marriage.
He first appears on the AV list 1918 living with the Ogborn's then in 1922 with Doreen at Gt. Colmore St.
They then disappear until 1935 when Doreen appears on the ER without William also 1950 & 55 even though they had children all in B'ham up to 1942.
No birth or death found.
Any ideas ?
The only scenario I can come up with now the others have been de-bunked is that he was the illegitimate son of Alfred but registered under the mother's name & appears on the census under that. He then changes his name to Shuter at joining the Army.
My OH's uncle did just that. Fortunately there were plenty of people still around that knew it.
Warks:Ashford;Cadby;Clarke;Clifford;Cooke Copage;Easthope;
Edmonds;Felton;Colledge;Lutwyche;Mander(s);May;Poole;Withers.
Staffs.Edmonds;Addison;Duffield;Webb;Fisher;Archer
Salop:Easthope,Eddowes,Hoorde,Oteley,Vernon,Talbot,De Neville.
Notts.Clarke;Redfearne;Treece.
Som.May;Perriman;Cox
India Kane;Felton;Cadby
London.Haysom.
Lancs.Gay.
Worcs.Coley;Mander;Sawyer.
Kings of Wessex & Scotland
Census information is Crown copyright,from
www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/

Offline Galium

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Re: Another shove in the right direction
« Reply #21 on: Sunday 09 July 17 20:23 BST (UK) »
Doreen is with Joseph Worton at least from 1930, when she is registered to vote as Doreen Kate Worton, along with Joseph at 22 Dulwich Grove, Perry Barr.
UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline kitch59

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Re: Another shove in the right direction
« Reply #22 on: Sunday 09 July 17 20:52 BST (UK) »
Doreen Kate was in two relationships, with william and joseph that i know, the start of this thread was to find out more about William, and i thank you guys for your input, it has helped a lot, i was a bit too tunneled visioned, just having a different perspective works
Just Gardners at the moment from Birmingham & Oxford

Online jim1

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Re: Another shove in the right direction
« Reply #23 on: Sunday 09 July 17 22:10 BST (UK) »
Unfortunately no closer to finding him.
Warks:Ashford;Cadby;Clarke;Clifford;Cooke Copage;Easthope;
Edmonds;Felton;Colledge;Lutwyche;Mander(s);May;Poole;Withers.
Staffs.Edmonds;Addison;Duffield;Webb;Fisher;Archer
Salop:Easthope,Eddowes,Hoorde,Oteley,Vernon,Talbot,De Neville.
Notts.Clarke;Redfearne;Treece.
Som.May;Perriman;Cox
India Kane;Felton;Cadby
London.Haysom.
Lancs.Gay.
Worcs.Coley;Mander;Sawyer.
Kings of Wessex & Scotland
Census information is Crown copyright,from
www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/

Offline Galium

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Re: Another shove in the right direction
« Reply #24 on: Monday 10 July 17 14:44 BST (UK) »
If we assume that William was truthful about  his father's details when he married Doreen, then I think that Alfred Shuter, carpenter and disappearing husband of Fanny looks like the best candidate.

He is probably the Alfred Frederick Shuter registered in 1860, mother's maiden name Davis
There is a  marriage in 1842 in West Bromwich district of William Shuter; Ann Davis appearing on the same page as per the FreeBMD index. There are some trees on Ancestry which agree that William Shuter married Ann Davis, although no one seems to have a marriage register copy. They also agree that Alfred Frederick is their son, but  have Alfred's wife's name as Fanny Daisey.  There is no evidence for this actually being her name.
Although Alfred does not always use his middle name (eg when he married), his death in 1937 is registered with both names.

I have not been able to find Alfred in 1901.  It appears likely that he had already left his wife and family by then.  He may perhaps be with a woman named Lettie Hill.

Alfred and Lettie Shuter baptised a daughter named Lily at St James, Handsworth on 19 February 1908.  They live at an address  in Alfred Street.  Alfred is a carpenter.
The birth of Lily Shuter, Mmn Hill was registered in March Q 1908 in West Bromwich district.

Lily is not with her parents in 1911, but as she grew up and married a William Cook in 1932, she must be somewhere. (She shows up in Smethwick 1939 living on the same street as Lettie (whose name appears as Shirter. Lettie died in 1968)

The only other Shuter birth registered between 1890 and 1910 with Mmn Hill is a Cornelius in June Q 1895 in Birmingham.  I can't see any likely Shuter - Hill marriage.

No sign of Cornelius anywhere after 1895 (not even in New Zealand!), until a Cornelius Shuter death is registered in Worthing district in 1968. He is aged 72.

The National Probate Calender for 1969:

SHUTER Cornelius otherwise William of 35 North La East Preston Littlehampton Sx died 14 February 1968 Administration London



UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Online jim1

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Re: Another shove in the right direction
« Reply #25 on: Monday 10 July 17 15:25 BST (UK) »
Quote
He may perhaps be with a woman named Lettie Hill.
That would account for the curious 1911 entry.

Quote
The only other Shuter birth registered between 1890 and 1910 with Mmn Hill is a Cornelius in June Q 1895 in Birmingham.  I can't see any likely Shuter - Hill marriage.
Quote
SHUTER Cornelius otherwise William
Is this our missing William.?
I think it is. Right name, right age & right father.
I think the 1911 census contains a lot of misinformation. It's quite possible Cornelius/William & Lily are there but deliberately left off.
Warks:Ashford;Cadby;Clarke;Clifford;Cooke Copage;Easthope;
Edmonds;Felton;Colledge;Lutwyche;Mander(s);May;Poole;Withers.
Staffs.Edmonds;Addison;Duffield;Webb;Fisher;Archer
Salop:Easthope,Eddowes,Hoorde,Oteley,Vernon,Talbot,De Neville.
Notts.Clarke;Redfearne;Treece.
Som.May;Perriman;Cox
India Kane;Felton;Cadby
London.Haysom.
Lancs.Gay.
Worcs.Coley;Mander;Sawyer.
Kings of Wessex & Scotland
Census information is Crown copyright,from
www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/

Offline kitch59

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Re: Another shove in the right direction
« Reply #26 on: Monday 10 July 17 17:53 BST (UK) »
what does Mmn mean
Just Gardners at the moment from Birmingham & Oxford