John Joyce of Beckington, 21 Bath Road, Beckington, Somerset.

[Moffitt77]

Am
Annette, I thought when I saw Maryanne as a witness, that she could be the wife of one of the men, eg Mary Ann married to John Wallis? That would leave one space amongs the ten children. There is a wide gap between number one and number two??? I just can't leave this alone yet😕

[Annette7]

A 'Marianne Joyce' was a witness to Daniel Bailey Joyce's marriage to Eliza Hall in 1835 together with a James Joyce.  This was 16 years before John Wallis married his Mary Ann!

All the marriages of the sons were as bachelors and no trace of the daughters having any illegitimate children to a 'Parker' or otherwise.   

Annette

[ShaunJ]

Per the newspaper announcement of the 1835 marriage , Daniel Bailey Joyce ( " D B Joyce) was the 3rd son of Mr J Joyce of Beckington. (Bath Chronicle and Weekly Gazette 24 December 1835)

[ShaunJ]

There are newspaper announcements in April 1826 of the marriage of William Joyce of Beckington to Mary Ann Brookes, eldest daughter of Benjamin Brookes of Keward.

Looking at the 1851 census ( Bunny Lane Farm, Rowde) I think this William is the father of the William who married Anna Wace Joyce in New Zealand. He has his widowed mother Mary Joyce (75) with him so I think he may possibly be a nephew rather than a son of John Joyce.

[Moffitt77]

Shaun, I have to comment that you have amazed me once again.

Are we now looking for the 'second son' who fits in between James and Daniel? It is so hard to give up on a search when there is a tiny clue to more possible information.

Based on a pittance of clues, I once found the following:-
Arthur J Joyce, Newspaper Writer, London, born 1819, Bath, Somerset. I was never able to find out any more. James Parker Joyce named one son Arthur.

He also had a son called William James, born 1865, not recorded in his obituary.

Papers Past - By 1 May 1863, the Joyce party of gold miners struck it rich at Maori Point on the Shotover River. Each member of the party had 60lbs of gold after six weeks of work. They went back for more!
Michael Joyce
James Joyce
David Finlan
William Ryan
Peter Kelly
Michael Darmaby

Sudden riches. What did they do with it?

Papers Past 1863, James Parker Joyce advertised his Royal Hotel at St John's Kingston.

Michael Joyce, 1816- 95, had a ship built! He was referred to from then as Captain Joyce of Port Chalmers, although he had been in the Water Police in Australia.

I cannot help but connect these incidents. Michaels' son John was born in St Ives in 1839. He became a lawyer and was MP for Lyttelton. Another son, Michael, 1846-1882 lived in Sydenham.

Were the two men brothers, or were they father and son? The New Zealand picture seems to show up a lot of uncle/nephew emigrations also.

This is why I thought originally that the message about The death of James Bailey Joyce was in the Lyttelton Times.

[ShaunJ]

Other obits mention his boyhood in the Channel islands:

https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/SOCR19030124.2.25

https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/NZFL19030131.2.2

Just wondering if there is a connection with Captain Daniel Joyce (1816-1884), a mariner from Jersey, who came to New Zealand in the 1840's (possibly earlier) and died in Fiji in 1884. Father James Joyce, mother Isabella Watson.

[trish1120]

Re MICHAEL Joyce

MARRIAGE;
25 December 1838, St Ives, Cornwall
Michael JOYCE, Bachelor, Mariner, Father JOHN a Mariner
Mary Ann HOLLOW, Spinster, Father DANIEL a Fisherman

1841 under Joice, Michae/Mary and Son John, are living next door to Her Parents.

1851 as you probably know Michael is born c 1816 Youghall, Ireland

[Moffitt77]

I've only started gathering together the bits and pieces about Michael Joyce. He married quite late in life and had what I think was a second family. Interest developed when I tried to find the James Bailey connection to Lyttelton, where Michael's son was an MP.

In searching through ships' passenger lists I have often seen the name Joyce for the captain. I have not collected these details. I think that I did not make any connection between the two captains, because of deaths in different places. They could well be connected. I will try to gather my notes.

I like the Channel Islands approach. My searches there have always come up blank. It could be my fault. JPJ was apparently fluent in French, so his time there must have been reasonably long.

JPJ was also a very able sportsman. One story (Carrick) has him with settler Rees on Rees' boat on Lake Wakatipu in Central Otago. This was a very remote and dangerous place at the time. I think it was the only boat there, and it was the only reasonable way of getting to Rees' station halfway up the lake. For a dare JPJ leapt into the lake and swam round the boat. He was there in a news capacity I believe, and of course, according to Carrick, he sent the news aboutthe Discovery of gold-bearing land, back to his paper. The rest is history. I have not checked Carrick's account, but he wrote it to pay tribute to JPJ after his death.

One story has it that JPJ's son, William James, was one of the first European children born in Nokomai, Central Otago. This birth is not recorded in his family records.

[Moffitt77]

Trish, I did not know that Michael was born in Youghall, Ireland. Thank.

When I have been searching through Phillimore's church records etc, I have noticed that there are not as many early Joyce births as I would expect in English counties. The obvious answer was migration to Scotland, England and then the Colonies.