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Harcourt Leonard Hartnett birth date and place and his birth parent/parents?

Harcourt Leonard Hartnett birth date and place?
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Offline Sandidel

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Harcourt Leonard Hartnett
« on: Tuesday 11 July 17 09:10 BST (UK) »
Hi
I am trying to find the birth of Harcourt Leonard Hartnett he was rumoured among his family to have been born in New Zealand or Newcastle, Australia but no records have been found.  I have no idea when he was born?? His daughter Monica was born 1931, Parramatta, Nsw.

This is the tread I had on NZ Rootschat you can check it out to see what has been found so far.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=774616.new;topicseen#new

If anyone can help that would be great!

Thanks
Sandi
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Offline Jamjar

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Re: Harcourt Leonard Hartnett
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 11 July 17 11:27 BST (UK) »
Sandi, as you will see there is no mention of a Harcourt in this family.

William and Agnes' children:

20907/1959 Mary Ellen G Hartnett CHATSWOOD

40865/1974 Nelson Edward William Hartnett

HARTNETT   Nelson William Edward Death notice 1-1-1974 Death 66 late of Darlinghurst Sydney Morning Herald 3-1-1974

Nelson's court marshall: https://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/ViewImage.aspx?B=302416

Marriage:

10113/1915 Amber R HARTNETT to Donald D REID ANNANDALE
16839/1927 Amber R REID to Thomas SMITH NORTH SYDNEY

Death of Amber: 30046/1969 Amber Rose SMITH parents William and Agnes KOGARAH

SMITH Amber Rose Death notice 19-8-1969 Death 77 late of Peakhurst Sydney Morning Herald 23-8-1969

Death of Donald: 10339/1923 Donald D REID parents Alfred E and Amy ROCKDALE

Death notice: http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article16088697

Funeral notice: http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article16088852

Death of Thomas: 24159/1976 Thomas SMITH parents William and Martha

SMITH Thomas Death notice 21-9-1976 Death 84 late of Peakhurst Sydney Morning Herald 27-9-1976

At Woronora Cemetery:

Amber Rose Smith 19-8-1969, Burial Anglican Monumental - Section Aj - 0697

Thomas Smith 21-9-1976 Burial Anglican Monumental - Section Aj - 0697


Marriage:

3643/1921 Myrtle L HARTNETT to Ethelbert C LUGTON ST LEONARDS

Death:

65381/1973 Myrtle Lillian LUGTON parents William and Agnes ST LEONARDS

LUGTON Myrtle Lillian Death notice 6-12-1973 Death 83 late of Northbridge Sydney Morning Herald 7-12-1973

5781/1947 Ethelbert Charles LUGTON parents William and Annie Rebecca NORTH SYDNEY

http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article18018726

At Macquarie Park Cemetery: METHODIST MONUMENTAL, D5, Grave 0006
Lugton Myrtle Lillian 6-12-1973
Lugton E Charles 12-2-1947

Their son's death: 10725/1959 Ronald William LUGTON CHATSWOOD

LUGTON Ronald William Death notice 3-5-1959 Death 36 at RPA Hospital, late of Northbridge Sydney Morning Herald 5-5-1959

His marriage: 3789/1949 Ronald William LUGTON to Josephine Ellen Margaret RYDE

Josephine's death: LUGTON Josephine Ellen Margaret Death notice 13-11-2013 Death 88 late of Denistone SMH 16-11-2013

At Northern Suburbs Memorial Gardens:

Ronald: Location: Crescent CourtSection: Wall 8
http://www.heavenaddress.com/restingplace/northernsuburbsmemorialgardens/ronald-william-lugton/711225

Josephine: Location: Memorial Garden DESection: Lot: Location 130
Born on 15 September 1925
Passed away on 13 November 2013
Aged 88 years


Daughter of Myrtle: 3898/1957 Peggy Narelle LUGTON to Stefan Robert SATMARI NORTH SYDNEY

SATMARI Peggy Narelle Death notice 4-6-2005 Death at Bathurst Base Hospital Sydney Morning Herald 6-6-2005

SATMARI Stefan Robert (Steve) Death notice 31-10-2001 Death at Bathurst Base Hospital Western Advocate (Bathurst) 2-10-2001

I can't see a NSW marriage or death for Edna LUGTON.

Jamjar
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Offline Aussie1947

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Re: Harcourt Leonard Hartnett
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 11 July 17 11:41 BST (UK) »
Hi,

The WW2 Nominal Roll Index has Harcourt Leonard Hartnett born 5th July 1903 in Newcastle NSW.

http://www.ww2roll.gov.au/NameSearch.aspx

Gerry

Offline Jamjar

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Re: Harcourt Leonard Hartnett
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 11 July 17 13:18 BST (UK) »
Harcourt is buried with wife Violet and son Leonard

CHURCH OF ENGLAND, K5, Grave 0022

Hartnett Leonard Robert W 15-4-1941 He was 7 years 7 mths:

7182/1941 Leonard Robert William HARTNETT CHATSWOOD

http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article17719336

Hartnett Violet Louisa 3-3-1996

As well as considering that he may have been an illegitimate child of one of the daughters, he also could possibly have been adopted, or as you say a child of a sibling.

J.
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Offline maddys52

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Re: Harcourt Leonard Hartnett
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 12 July 17 00:12 BST (UK) »
Interested in this thread, so just adding - I couldn't see the births of May and Myrtle on the previous thread http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=774616.0

but realised they are indexed under HARTNELL:

3688/1888 May E G (Sydney)
2460/1890 Myrtle Lilian (Sydney)

Hi,

The WW2 Nominal Roll Index has Harcourt Leonard Hartnett born 5th July 1903 in Newcastle NSW.

http://www.ww2roll.gov.au/NameSearch.aspx

Gerry

Apparently the family thought he fudged his age so that he could enlist at the end of WW1.

Online Dundee

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Re: Harcourt Leonard Hartnett
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 12 July 17 02:36 BST (UK) »
He enlisted for service in WW2, not WW1 as far as I can see.  He already had a military service background as shown in the previous thread:

  from NSW Police Gazettes  1925   Leonard Harnett Harcourt   age 22  charged with deserting from Royal Australian Garrison Artillery at Paddington - native of Newcastle - Metal Worker

Muss

Had also been about to add the 1925 NSW Police Gazette entry as found by Muss.   ;)

Just to expand on it though ... and to emphasise that the name was shown as

Leonard Harnett (rather than Hartnett) ...  and with HARCOURT as the surname, the listing also included a regimental number > No. 598
[Source:  New South Wales Police Gazette - 29 July 1925 :  Date of desertion given as 13th instant (i.e.  13 July 1925). ]

In a Commonwealth of Australia Gazette, dated No. 97, of 24 June 1948, this entry :
Long Service and Good Conduct Medal :  Temporary Quartermasters and Honorary Lieutenants :
NP 598 (NX70192) (Major) Harcourt Leonard HARTNETT.

As can be seen, both have the same regt. number.   

I suppose you have to ask whether HLH originally enlisted as "Leonard Harnett HARCOURT" ... or was there an error in the names published in the NSW Police Gazette ???

    ~  Lu

The surviving attestation documents and personnel dossiers for the PMF and Militia outside of the war years are name indexed on the NAA website and I cannot see anything there for him.

Apparently the family thought he fudged his age.......

Harcourt married for the first time in 1924 and even that is quite young for a man to marry in that time period if he was born in 1903, so I doubt that he would be any younger.

His age in 1925 was said to be 22 which confirms the 1903 year of birth.

He enlisted at the beginning of WW2 on 28 March 1940, probably as an Officer. In May 1940 the upper age for recruits was increased from 35 to 40, and the upper age limit for officers was Lieutenants 30, Captains 35, Majors 40, and Lieutenant-Colonels 45.

Debra  :)

Offline cando

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Re: Harcourt Leonard Hartnett
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 12 July 17 02:50 BST (UK) »
Please read the link.  Does not idicate that Wm and Elizabeth were his birth parents.

http://artilleryhistory.org/gunners_past_and_present/gunners_of_renown_gunners_tales/gunners_of_renown/chapter_3/documents/bio_hartnett_harcourt_leonard.pdf

Hal  Hartnett  was  born  on  5  July  1903,  place  of  birth  unknown,  and was raised by  William and Elizabeth Hartnett.
 He was educated at Mosman Preparatory School and Fort Street Boys High  School,  Sydney.  His  father  had  served  in  the  Sudan  with  the  Field Batter  NSW Artillery and was a captain in WW I. 


I have done a wildcard search for births on 5 Jul 1903 on NSW BDM...nothing stands out.  Search with given name * 

Cando
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Offline cando

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Re: Harcourt Leonard Hartnett
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 12 July 17 03:07 BST (UK) »
William Edward HARTNETT was born in India.  NOK Elizabeth.
https://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/NAAMedia/ShowImage.aspx?B=4735953&T=P&S=1

Cando
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Online Dundee

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Re: Harcourt Leonard Hartnett
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 12 July 17 03:22 BST (UK) »
The children of William and Agnes:

1888  May
1890  Myrtle
1892  Amber
1907  Nelson

So in 1903 they had three daughters and no son so he may have just been a random adoption and not related at all.  I still find it odd that he was, to my mind, either actively excluded from the family, or he came into the family with William's second wife.  From 1914....

HARTNETT - In fond memory of our dear mother, who died at Mosman, June 28, 1907. Sadly missed
hy her loving children, May, Myrtle, Amber, and only son, Nelson.

In 1913 the electoral roll shows William, Myrtle, May, and William's brother Henry living in Newcastle and    William remarried in April 1913.

Perhaps Elizabeth's divorce records from 1912 might clarify whether or not she had any dependants.

Debra  :)