Author Topic: Help with Norwegian church records  (Read 2244 times)

Offline EmFrank

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Re: Help with Norwegian church records
« Reply #9 on: Tuesday 25 July 17 23:32 BST (UK) »
Hi Ian. i had seen that entry, but wasnt convinced. I think the same Ancestry source had John Halvorsen's wife as Karen Kirstine Jensdr, which I believe is incorrect.
Anyway, thanks for your help. It has  directed me towards some new information.
Regards
Frank

Offline jamcat95

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Re: Help with Norwegian church records
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 26 July 17 09:54 BST (UK) »

 wife as Karen Kirstine Jensdr, which I believe is incorrect.


Hi
I took a look again and they have her name as "Karen Kiah Christiana Isook"

By the way who and when did the family emigrate to USA?


Ian


Offline EmFrank

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Re: Help with Norwegian church records
« Reply #11 on: Thursday 27 July 17 00:54 BST (UK) »
Hi Ian,
I believe her name was Karen Kirstine Isachsen. It is spelt Isaach on some records. I dont know when the family migrated, but two of their children have US descendants. They are Ingeborg Sophie, and Halvor Christian.  I can check more on that if you are interested.
I have just put a notice on a Norway forum, and have had confirmation that John Halverson was from Holt, Aust-Agder, and that he was 38 1/2 in 1832, making his birth 1893, and thence the son of Halvor Madesen, as you thought.
My connection is that I am trying to trace my gggrandfather  who was from Arendal (near Holt) and he jumped ship in Melbourne Australia in the early 1850s, and changed his name. I have found a DNA match with descendants of John Halvorsen, via both of this above mentioned children, which is why I am pursuing this line.
I feel that I am getting much closer.
Regards from Australia
Frank

Offline jamcat95

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Re: Help with Norwegian church records
« Reply #12 on: Thursday 27 July 17 09:25 BST (UK) »
Hi Frank

Good idea to post in Norway. I have found your post in Norway. Nice to see what it actually says. My area is really Sweden but I can get around in Scandinavia.
What was the name of your ancestor in Australia and was Arendal recorded on a certificate. Also, how do you know he jumped ship.

Ian



Offline EmFrank

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Re: Help with Norwegian church records
« Reply #13 on: Thursday 27 July 17 23:50 BST (UK) »
Hi Ian,
His name was Christopher Tudor. The name Christopher is OK, but not Tudor. it could have been Theodor, which I understand could be pronounced similarly, but havent found anyone of that name in Norway.
Arendal came from his naturalisation record and the birth records of his 11 children, for which most he recorded his birthplace as Arendal, Norway,  and a for a couple he said Christiana.
The jumping ship came from passed down family stories.  On his 1887 naturalisation record he said he came on the ship Copernicus in 1857. it only came to Australia in 1854 and there is a record of a ships deserter from the Copernicus- Claus August Jacob, aged 20 , from Norway (Fair complexion, light brown hair, blue eyes, cannot speak English, 5 pounds reward) I Cant find him either in Norwegian records.
His birth date, from 15 records, is that it is from August 1831 to January 1835, with the most likely being 1833/34.
He also recorded that his parents names were Christopher and Elisabeth.

I have looked at lots of possibilities over the years, without finding anyone that would seem to match. Thats why I am now pinning my hopes on DNA.
Regards
Frank

Offline jamcat95

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Re: Help with Norwegian church records
« Reply #14 on: Friday 28 July 17 16:04 BST (UK) »
Hi Frank

I took a dig into the books and found this.....interesting I think:

I have helped with Scandinavian seaman before and have seen that those who jumped ship nearly all have changed their surnames so as not to get caught. So the surname Tudor is most probably made up and not from Norway although you can never be sure. It was fairly common that Norwegians took their surname from the farm they lived at, but no Tudor sounding name was on the list. I took a look at the farm names in Arendal here:
http://en.infodesti.com/NO/Farms/Arendal

I have found a Christopher Christophersen born 3 June 1835 in Arendal. His parents were Christopher, a cobbler and Astrid. Although Astrid is not the recorded Elizabeth, the name could have been recorded incorrectly. I think it might be worth looking into this family.
This Christopher had siblings:

Christine
Randea
Marie
Jens - seaman
Theresia
Tellef

1835 - Birth: https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/9402/87325/80
1835 - Arendal Census: https://media.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/51206/4
1855 - Arendal Census - No Christopher - https://media.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/51208/6
1865 - Arendal Census - with Astrid and Marie - https://media.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/38154/92?indexing=

There is also a record for a Christopher Christophersen as a seaman - nr 468:
https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/42315/165


Here is the search engine for Norway:
https://media.digitalarkivet.no/kb/browse



Ian


Offline EmFrank

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Re: Help with Norwegian church records
« Reply #15 on: Saturday 29 July 17 02:51 BST (UK) »
Hi Ian,
I had considered Christopher born 1835, but thought he was probbaly too late, and I tended to think that its was more likley that his mother was Elisabeth. Anyway, i have looked again- the marriage record also says Astri. I wondered if she may have died and he  remarried, but acouldnt find anything to support that. i will keep looking.
Re the Chrsitopher who was sailor, if I read it correctly, he came from notteroy, and i found a Christopher Christophersen born at Notteroy of different parents, so probably not our man.

 I am curious as how you accessed the censuses and the seamen?  I tried accessing censuses and they seem much more limited than you found?
I could look at the census page you gave me the connection to, but i couldnt find it myself on the main website.
Regards
Frank



Offline jamcat95

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Re: Help with Norwegian church records
« Reply #16 on: Saturday 29 July 17 21:02 BST (UK) »
Hi

You can search the seaman records for Norway here: http://www.rootschat.com/links/01kgy/

And the Censuses here: https://media.digitalarkivet.no/en/ft/browse?municipalities%5B0%5D=0903&text=

I hope the links work as they should.



Ian


Offline EmFrank

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Re: Help with Norwegian church records
« Reply #17 on: Monday 31 July 17 05:19 BST (UK) »
Hi Ian,
Thankyou. i have finally manged to be able to access the censuses. In the meantime, i have come up with a possible person. Its probably a long shot, but I would like your opinion as to anything i might be able to do to make it more likely (or unlikely).
I have a DNA match with two children of John Halvorsen and Karen Kirstine Isaachsdr, who had children at Holt near Arendal betrween 1823 and 1835. John Halvorsen was born at Holt in 1793, the son of Halvor Madsen and Ingeborg Johnsdr. Halvor and Ingeborg had five children at Holt, between 1788 and 1800, none of whom were had any children named Christopher or Elisabeth.

Halvor and his sons worked for an ironworks at Holt.  Halvor was born about 1755, and was married at Holt in 1787 when he was about 32. There is a record of a Halvor Madsen married to Johanne Monsdr in 1779 at Asker, about 180km north of Arendal, near Oslo. There was an old  ironworks at  Baerum ironworks, 10km from Asker.

This Halvor Madsen and his wife, had a son Christen, born 1781 at Asker. As far is known, they had no other children. A Christen Halvorsen married to Lisbeth Andersdr in 1826 at Sem, which is about 50km south of Asker. They had a son, Christopher born in 1832 at Lier, Buskerud, near Asker. They had four other children born at Lier between 1826 and 1838.  The birth records indicate that Christen Halvorsen was a ‘Guardsman’, which I assume is some sort of military.

So I have a Christopher born in 1832 to Christen and Lisbeth, and who could be a grandson of Halvor Madsen of Holt, if he married twice.  This could fit with my man,(born 1831-1835, son of Christopher and Elisabeth) except for the birth location, unless he moved to Holt near Arendal at an early age, perhaps if his father died and the family moved closer to relatives at Holt.
Any thoughts?
Regards
Frank