1840 Births OPR Beith Ayrshire - YOUNG

[Retsina]

Could you please check the Births OPR for Beith Ayrshire for my great grandfather William Young.  I believe he was born around 1840 give or take 5 years.

[MonicaL]

Hi Retsina

Do you have details of his parents' names?

Monica

Added: There is this entry for example https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTV4-XQP

[Retsina]

Sorry I should have mentioned his parents were William and Ann(e) not sure of the spelling.  She was Ann King, but unfortunately I don't have the date of their marriage either.

Thanks

[MonicaL]

Pre 1855 and the start of official registration in Scotland, you may not find a birth or marriage entry for them. Only about a third of events were recorded in the Old Parish Registers (assuming they belonged to the established Church of Scotland and were presybterian).

I can see this likely entry for young William in 1841:

Ann King 20  Over Sowster
William Young 1
David King 20 shoemaker journeyman

Address: Gateside, Beith

Always the possibility that Ann King and William Young Snr were not married...

What else do you have on William Young Jnr.?

Monica

[MonicaL]

There is this entry for 1851 which could be him. In this respect, 'inmate' I think just means resident there (it is not an institution):

Thomas White 84 farmer
William Young 11 inmate b. Beith
Jean King 34 servant b. Dunlop, Ayrshire

Address: Giffen Castle Farm, Beith

Jean King could be a sister to Ann maybe or relative?

Monica

[Retsina]

Thank you so much Monica you have been most helpful.  Talk about needles in haystacks!  I think you are on the right track though.  Ann definitely had a sister Jean and also a brother Robert.  I found the family in the 1841 census, with father Robert and 5 siblings, Jean is aged 25, but no mention of Ann, so finding her living with a David King (not sure who he is as they are the same age?), and son William aged 1 is a definite possibility.  The question is where is William snr?  It is possible that they never married, which would explain why I haven't found a marriage record.  The record in the 1851 census with Jean and William living with Thomas White at Giffen Castle Farm would seem to be the best match. In the 1861 census finds William now aged 21 living with Jean and Mary White King aged 79 (not sure how Mary is related to the Kings)?  Then I think I have found William again in the 1871 census aged 27 living in Glasgow as a lodger (he did get around!).
There doesn't seem to be any info about Ann King after 1841 - no birth, marriage or death record.  I'm assuming that she may have remarried or perhaps died which would explain why William is living with his aunt Jean?  What happened to William snr is another mystery as I can't find a birth, marriage or death record for him at all.  They were certainly staunch Presbyterian, so maybe there might be a baptism record? I believe there is a "Young family" grave at Beith cemetery, but haven't been able to confirm this.  Any further leads you can find would be most useful. Thanks very much.

[MonicaL]

Hi Retsina

Just picking up on some of your comments above:

 I think you are on the right track though.  Ann definitely had a sister Jean and also a brother Robert.  I found the family in the 1841 census, with father Robert and 5 siblings, Jean is aged 25, but no mention of Ann...

There are quite a few King families in Beith in those years so without further details, I wouldn't necessarily assume at this time that this is Ann's family at this time without further checks on records.

...but no mention of Ann, so finding her living with a David King (not sure who he is as they are the same age?), and son William aged 1 is a definite possibility.
 

The 1841 census is the most limited in terms of info. No relationships within the household were given. Also, ages for those over 15 were supposed to be rounded down to the nearest five years. So in that 1841 census entry, Ann and David could be aged between 20-24. Ages for those under 15 were supposed to show at their actual age (or as actual as census ages ever are!).

The 1861 census that you mention, shows Mary White King as Jean King's mother:

Mary White King 79 head b. Beith
Jean King 46 daughter b. Beith (1851 gave Dunlop as her birth place)
William Young 20 boarder wright b. Beith

Address: Giffen, Beith

There is possily some family connection to that 1851 entry and farmer Thomas White.

In the absence of details so far on Ann King, maybe looking for Jean King's death reg might provide details on her parents.

Monica

[MonicaL]

With the referece we saw earlier for Jean King from 1851, I wondered if that where the King family was originally from.

There are these two entries for example in Dunlop:

Thomas 1804 https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTVF-R4H
Mary 1823 https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XYQC-3X7 - unclear as to why mother shows as Mary or Jean 

These are from Family Search. The free search on Scotlands People also shows:

Ann King - parents Robert King and Mary White.    
22/08/1816
Dunlop Ayrshire

In total, on SP, there are 10 entries. These include a Jean in 1806 and two David (first must have died). Birth years range from 1802-1823.

Mary White King looks to have died after 1861 and her death will be on the statutory register. This should let you confirm further details. Possible death entry showing for her in 1865 at the age of 83 in Beith. Possible birth or christening entry for a Mary White to parents Thomas and Jean (Smith) in Beith in 1782. Hopefully Mary's death reg will help with this all.

Monica

[MonicaL]

Interesting snippet on Giffen Farm and Thomas White here which includes:

 Thomas Craig, grandson of Robert, passed on the feu to Thomas White in 1816, during whose possession the castle met its final fall, inspiring the following indignant poem by James Wilson, the local poet...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barony_and_Castle_of_Giffen

Includes a drawing of the castle and also likely Giffen Farm. Would be good to try to follow up on the family line of Mary White and Thomas White to see if they are siblings.

Monica