British mariner - 1770s - apprenticeship

[NeMor]

I need some help on the customs and practices of the late 18th century British Merchant Navy.

My 4x great grandfather was Francis Emmet(t). He began a sea apprenticeship around 1778 and served for 6 years. He was on the “John and Mary” belonging to Richard Pratt of Faversham, Kent. The Pratts seem to have been a long-established family of merchants in coal and deals (timber), based in Faversham. I assume these facts would suggest a date of birth from 1763 to 1768 and a birthplace for Francis in Kent.

However, all the other records I have for him suggest his place of origin (or at least, residence) to be Newcastle upon Tyne, i.e. his marriage in 1794, the baptisms of his children from 1795 to 1806, a Royal Navy allotment record of 1798 and his wife’s petition to Trinity House in 1813.

In 1807 he was certainly serving on board a collier brig (the Expedition, of Sunderland) when he was taken prisoner by a French privateer. He remained a prisoner of war until at least 1813 then at some stage he returned to Tyneside where he died in 1838, described as a mariner.

My questions:
1)   does my assumption of a starting age of 10 to 15 for a seagoing apprenticeship in 1778 seem reasonable?
2)   why might a Kentish-owned collier vessel take on a Newcastle boy as an apprentice?
3)   does anyone know of any surviving sea apprenticeship records for the 1770s, particularly for Kent or Newcastle upon Tyne?

Any information or suggestions would be most gratefully received.

NeMor

[philipsearching]

My questions:
1)   does my assumption of a starting age of 10 to 15 for a seagoing apprenticeship in 1778 seem reasonable?
2)   why might a Kentish-owned collier vessel take on a Newcastle boy as an apprentice?
3)   does anyone know of any surviving sea apprenticeship records for the 1770s, particularly for Kent or Newcastle upon Tyne?

1) Around that time apprenticeships for land-based occupations started around 12 to 14.  Boys younger than 12 worked on boats, so the possibility of an apprenticeship at a younger age is possible (although I would suggest that a 7 year apprenticeship wopuld be unlikely to start before age 10 or 11).

2) If you know the expression "that would be like carrying coals to Newcastle" you will know that Newcastle was a major centre for the distribution of coal.  A collier registered in Kent would most probably get its supplies from Newcastle - over time the skipper would make contacts on shore and may have bern asked by one of them to take on a local lad.

3) There you've got me.  I know there are apprenticeship records on Anc***** and other sites, but I don't know what survives for merchant shipping.  Hopefully, Seaweed or another Rootschatter with more knowledge can help.

Hope this helps
Philip

[NeMor]

Philip

Many thanks for the quick response. Your idea that the apprenticeship might have been arranged through local contacts seems pretty plausible, especially as I can find no Emmets in Kent around this time but I know there were some in Newcastle (although unfortunately I can't link any of them to Francis).

NeMor

[seaweed]

I would concur with the first  point of Philips answer and too an extent to his second observation.
Do you know which port the JOHN AND MARY was registered? Just because a vessel was owned by a Faversham merchant doesn't necessarily mean she was registered at that particular port. This is important as there may be crew agreements indexed by Port of Registry.

Regards your "does anyone know of any surviving sea apprenticeship records for the 1770s, particularly for Kent or Newcastle upon Tyne?"

There are very few Apprenticeship records surviving before the 1820's. A long shot. It may be worth looking at Crisp's Indentures Held by the Society of Genealogists  which holds many Indentures of North East England seamen. dated 1845-1861.
Other than that try Book of Stamps, Apprenticeship Books available from TNA Kew  in IR1.
It would be worthwhile to read this.
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C9339

[NeMor]

Thanks, Seaweed

Unfortunately I don't know where the John and Mary was registered. The Lloyd's Register for 1778 lists 11 vessels with that name - and there may have been more as I believe that, before 1786, registration was voluntary and generally for foreign-going vessels.

I'm struggling to understand all the details on the Lloyd's Register, but I assume the 4th column relates to home port or port of registration. Of the 11 vessels listed, 1 has Newcastle in this column and 1 has Sunderland, whilst none mention Faversham.

I've also spent some time looking through old newspapers online and found numerous references to the "John & Mary" in shipping notes, including 2 references to a vessel, captained by Horton, sailing from Feversham (sic) to Shields carrying timbers. This sounds a good possibility for the vessel in which Francis Emmet sailed, as his ship's owner was a coal and timber merchant of Faversham.