Author Topic: A niece and an orphan in South Normanton in 1881  (Read 2511 times)

Offline medpat

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Re: A niece and an orphan in South Normanton in 1881
« Reply #18 on: Monday 19 February 18 09:50 GMT (UK) »
South Normanton in the late 1800s was a thriving coal mining area, my gt grandfather moved there from Walsall for about 3 years (2 children born there) but was back by 1890 for the birth of my grandfather.

The registration area was Mansfield a fair size town and not far, it had a thriving market. The area has many villages. Coal mines were numerous at one time. It's also quite rural.

The area is the Derbyshire/Nottinghamshire border.
Lloyd, Paddock, Cooper, Morris, Darby, Rigby, Platt, Armstrong. All based in West Midlands

GEDmatch M157477

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Offline Newfloridian

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Re: A niece and an orphan in South Normanton in 1881
« Reply #19 on: Monday 19 February 18 11:42 GMT (UK) »
Hello,

1891 2651/11/15
1901 3136/27/45

Thirza is daughter to Sarah Renshaw

Heywood

I have finally found the 1891 census return for this family in South Normanton. There is one small but perhaps important feature (absence) in this record which reads:

Joseph ?enshaw Head M (age could be anything from 20 to 36)
Sarah (blank) Wife M (age 42)
Thirza Gascoigne Daur S (age 18)

The important feature is that Sarah Does not have a surname OR a do (ditto) which every other wife in the list does have. I still haven't found a Joseph Henshaw, Renshaw, Kenshaw married to a Sarah Gascoigne / Gaskin in the marriage indexes. My reasoning here is that although they may have been living as man and wife, they weren't married.
Thirza is most definitely given her birth surname

Alan
Leicester / Northampton: Craxford,  Claypole, Pridmore, Pollard, Tansley, Crane, Tilley
Derby: Naylor, Ball, Haywood
Buckinghamshire: Cook
London: Craxford, Lane Crauford
Tyneside: Nessworthy, Simpson
______________________________________
"I am, in point of fact, a particularly haughty and exclusive person, of pre-Adamite ancestral descent.
You will understand this when I tell you that I can trace my ancestry back to a protoplasmal primordial atomic globule."
  -  WS Gilbert (The Mikado)

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Offline Nicolaxx

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Re: A niece and an orphan in South Normanton in 1881
« Reply #20 on: Monday 19 February 18 11:51 GMT (UK) »
I believe thirza is my great grandmother but I don't know anything about her ! Do you know her date of birth or date she passed ! I've found her in south normanton grave yard but its just a pot urn you can make out her name but nothing else and where the pot is its not in the right place ...... Its on top of another grave ! Would love to know more ! Thank you

Offline Dizzifish

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Re: A niece and an orphan in South Normanton in 1881
« Reply #21 on: Monday 19 February 18 12:29 GMT (UK) »
Hi Nicola,

Welcome to Rootschat!

Here are a couple of bits of information that might fill some of the gaps for you and Alan.

Thirza Gascoigne married Henry Ball at Mansfield Register Office in 1897 - but to get the details you would need to purchase the certificate.

Marriage at St Michael, South Normanton, Derbyshire. - 21st Aug 1886 - by banns.
Joseph RENSHAW, aged 27 y, Bachelor, Collier, of South Normanton.
Father = Hercules Renshaw, Collier.
Sarah GASCOIGNE, aged 35y, spinster, Char Woman, of South Normanton.
Father = Enoch Gascoigne, Collier.
Both made their mark X
Witnesses = Samuel Gascoigne & Amey Fletcher
~ ~ ~

Added....

Baptism - South Normanton, Derbyshire.
19th March 1873 - Thirza, mother = Sarah GASKIN, abode =  South Normanton, Single Woman.


Burial at South Normanton, Derbyshire.
Thirza BALL, abode = 12, Hamlet Lane, South Normanton - 15th Nov 1926 - aged 53 yrs.

Offline Nicolaxx

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Re: A niece and an orphan in South Normanton in 1881
« Reply #22 on: Monday 19 February 18 13:17 GMT (UK) »
Thank you ! I had my family tree done a few years ago by somebody that just does it has a hobby . she has put that Thirza mum to be Sarah ? And Thirza dad ? Gascoigne but Enoch and Ellen are down has Thirza dads perants ! Thirza's baptism date is spooky my Grandad her son Samuel died 19th March 1993 !

Online heywood

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Re: A niece and an orphan in South Normanton in 1881
« Reply #23 on: Monday 19 February 18 13:41 GMT (UK) »

Marriage at St Michael, South Normanton, Derbyshire. - 21st Aug 1886 - by banns.
Joseph RENSHAW, aged 27 y, Bachelor, Collier, of South Normanton.
Father = Hercules Renshaw, Collier.
Sarah GASCOIGNE, aged 35y, spinster, Char Woman, of South Normanton.
Father = Enoch Gascoigne, Collier.
Both made their mark X
Witnesses = Samuel Gascoigne & Amey Fletcher

This is a great find Dizzifish.

Free BMD indexes

September quarter 1886 Mansfield 7b pg 98
Sarah Gascoigne
There is a spouse missing.

Joseph Renshaw does show correctly in the index pages.

Heywood
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Newfloridian

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Re: A niece and an orphan in South Normanton in 1881
« Reply #24 on: Monday 19 February 18 14:07 GMT (UK) »
Hi Sheila

That information is most helpful. A couple more chinks filled into the South Normanton wall!

Nicola:

My maternal grandmother died five days after my mother was born - and she was brought up by her aunt and uncle. Said uncle was William Ball - who if my calculations are correct was third cousin to Henry Ball (your grandfather?). What's even more interesting in the light of the intermarriage complexity of the area, Henry and William's common ancestors were Jonathon Gaskin and Ann Mellor

I'll send you a PM!

Alan

Leicester / Northampton: Craxford,  Claypole, Pridmore, Pollard, Tansley, Crane, Tilley
Derby: Naylor, Ball, Haywood
Buckinghamshire: Cook
London: Craxford, Lane Crauford
Tyneside: Nessworthy, Simpson
______________________________________
"I am, in point of fact, a particularly haughty and exclusive person, of pre-Adamite ancestral descent.
You will understand this when I tell you that I can trace my ancestry back to a protoplasmal primordial atomic globule."
  -  WS Gilbert (The Mikado)

Offline Newfloridian

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Re: A niece and an orphan in South Normanton in 1881
« Reply #25 on: Monday 19 February 18 14:50 GMT (UK) »
I've now fallen into another morass - looking for Joseph Renshaw's parentage. The marriage quoted above has him born about 1859/60. There are two such births in the Mansfield region both in the June quarter of 1860:

Joseph - mother's maiden name Gascoigne  (07b 52)
Joseph - mother's maiden name Allcock (07b 49)

Looking at the 1871, there is no Hercules Renshaw listed - BUT there is an Archeleus Renshaw with his wife Ann and four children.

Archelaus Renshaw married Ann Gascoigne in the third quarter of 1854.

In 1781 the family were living at  84 Dog Pool.

Their neighbours at 83 were Hezekiah Gaskin and family:
At 87 were Enoch Gaskin and family (including Sarah)

So, looks as if Archelaus was transcribed in the Parish Records as Hercules.
Hey ho! now to trace back Ann Gascoigne!

Alan   
Leicester / Northampton: Craxford,  Claypole, Pridmore, Pollard, Tansley, Crane, Tilley
Derby: Naylor, Ball, Haywood
Buckinghamshire: Cook
London: Craxford, Lane Crauford
Tyneside: Nessworthy, Simpson
______________________________________
"I am, in point of fact, a particularly haughty and exclusive person, of pre-Adamite ancestral descent.
You will understand this when I tell you that I can trace my ancestry back to a protoplasmal primordial atomic globule."
  -  WS Gilbert (The Mikado)

Offline Newfloridian

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Re: A niece and an orphan in South Normanton in 1881
« Reply #26 on: Monday 19 February 18 15:05 GMT (UK) »
Well, well, well!

Ann (Hannah) Gascoigne's parents were Jonathan Gascoigne and Martha Simpson. Ann was born in 1835 the year after her parents marriage.

The 1841 census has the family living  at Street Side where their neighbours were William and Hannah Renshaw and their 9 children including 6 year old "Arkliss"!

The web draws ever tighter

Alan

 
Leicester / Northampton: Craxford,  Claypole, Pridmore, Pollard, Tansley, Crane, Tilley
Derby: Naylor, Ball, Haywood
Buckinghamshire: Cook
London: Craxford, Lane Crauford
Tyneside: Nessworthy, Simpson
______________________________________
"I am, in point of fact, a particularly haughty and exclusive person, of pre-Adamite ancestral descent.
You will understand this when I tell you that I can trace my ancestry back to a protoplasmal primordial atomic globule."
  -  WS Gilbert (The Mikado)