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I wonder if anyone would like to shed some light on this stone? It was handed down through the generations in Cwmwysg, Breconshire, probably from the Watkins family of Bryntywarch, Llwyncor, Brynmaen and back to Callwen. Diolch, Mei.

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Author Topic: Mysterious stone from Cwmwysg, Breconshire  (Read 3488 times)

Offline Ruskie

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Re: Mysterious stone from Cwmwysg, Breconshire
« Reply #9 on: Wednesday 09 August 17 23:42 BST (UK) »
Is that a carver's identification mark "M" or "W" on the reverse? Not that it will help ID it. Who was the earliest known owner of the stone that you are aware of (date wise)?

The fashions are probably an indication of date as already mentioned. Though it could have been carved later - it can't have been carved prior to that style of clothing.  :)

It's a lovely thing to have.

Offline Skoosh

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Re: Mysterious stone from Cwmwysg, Breconshire
« Reply #10 on: Thursday 10 August 17 09:35 BST (UK) »
One can imagine mysterious knocking during the night until it's returned to its rightful owner!  ;D

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Offline Gadget

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Re: Mysterious stone from Cwmwysg, Breconshire
« Reply #11 on: Thursday 10 August 17 09:45 BST (UK) »
That's what it reminds me of - the figures on the cover of an old copy of the Mabinogion.  We had to read it in school in Welsh  8)
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Offline Skoosh

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Re: Mysterious stone from Cwmwysg, Breconshire
« Reply #12 on: Thursday 10 August 17 09:54 BST (UK) »
Gadget, this earliest Welsh literature? hails from the kingdom of Strathclyde in the south of Scotland where Old Welsh was still spoken in isolated places until the Wars of Independence.

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Offline Gadget

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Re: Mysterious stone from Cwmwysg, Breconshire
« Reply #13 on: Thursday 10 August 17 10:00 BST (UK) »
Not sure if Welsh Celtic hails from Scotland - I was taught that the Welsh Celts in the SW were part of the wider Welsh Celtic principalities. Some of the old lineage books that I have have the Kings of Ireland and Man in them.
I've not got them off the shelf for a good while,so this from memory. 
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Offline Skoosh

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Re: Mysterious stone from Cwmwysg, Breconshire
« Reply #14 on: Thursday 10 August 17 10:15 BST (UK) »
To refresh your memory Gadget,       https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Y_Gododdin

Glasgow's oldest place-names are Welsh, then Gaelic then Scots. Glasgow & the Clyde are both Welsh.

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Offline Gadget

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Re: Mysterious stone from Cwmwysg, Breconshire
« Reply #15 on: Thursday 10 August 17 10:33 BST (UK) »
Yep - When I say SW Scotland, I mean Glasgow and Inverclyde down to Ayrshire and D & G. Most of my Scottish lines come from there too.

I once read- can't remember the ref - about the importance of the Irish Sea in our islands' history. If you centre a map on the Irish Sea, you can see how the peoples of the surrounding lands were so intermixed. Sea travel was so much better than land travel in those days. 
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Offline Skoosh

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Re: Mysterious stone from Cwmwysg, Breconshire
« Reply #16 on: Thursday 10 August 17 11:39 BST (UK) »
Gadget, Scotland south of the Forth was Welsh & indeed Pictish may also have been a related language. The Battle of Carham put a stop to Northumbrian ambitions & Gaelic spread to the present border!

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Offline Mei

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Re: Mysterious stone from Cwmwysg, Breconshire
« Reply #17 on: Thursday 10 August 17 13:04 BST (UK) »
Thank you Rosinish: I have made some fresh research and came up with a candidate to fit the "L Powel" inscribed on the stone. My gt gt gt gt grandfather was the rev William Watkins, curate of Callwen. His daughter, Gwenllian Watkins, married Llewelyn Powel. Could he be the figure in relief? and could he have been a clegyman? His style and attire are similar to those of people like Howell/Hywel Harries of Trefeca.

Gadget: Yes, the Callwen I refer to is the church between Defynnog and the the top of the Swansea Valley - not far from Dan-yr-Ogof Caves.

I'm beginning to wonder whether this could be a boundary stone? or possibly a stone placed above the entrance to a house or other building?

By the way, if anyone is interested in our family history - families in Cwmwysg (Breconshire) and Llanddeusant (Carmarthenshire), let me know and I'll send a link to the family tree.