Richard Gardner of Garstang 1797

[cristeen]

I am attempting to clarify the origins of my 4 x G grandfather Richard Gardner. He married Ann Baxter in 1817 at St Marys Lancaster, both were from Torrisholme at that time. He died in February 1855 , aged 59 giving a birth around 1796. The 1851 census states he was born in Halton (near Lancaster). The family story, from more than one source, is that he was from Garstang was attracted by the huge herring catches of the time and moved to Poulton-le-Sands (now Morecambe). Ten children are baptised at Poulton between 1818 and 1844 to Richard and Ann.
Lancs OPC has a baptism for a Richard Gardner on 8th August 1797 at St Helen's Garstang, the son of Thomas, husbandman from Bonds, and Ellen. There is also a marriage for Thomas Gardner (husbandman of Claughton) and Ellen Cardwell (spinster Myerscough) at the same church on 24 Oct 1786. I have a copy of the marriage record and the licence, so far so good!
Looking at baptisms for Thomas and Ellen at St Helens we start with Richard (13 Jul 1788, abode Claughton) followed by Ellen 1790, James 1792, Catherine 1794, Lydia 1795, Richard 1797, Thomas 1799, Mary 1801, Margaret 1803, Richard Cardwell 1805 and Catherine 1807 (born 12 Nov 1807, bap 13 Dec 1807). All these children have father recorded as Thomas a husbandman from Bonds and wife Ellen. There is one more baptism for John, the parish of Lancaster, born 11 Dec 1807, bap 17 Jan 1808, father Thomas is a husbandman and wife Ellen.
I have some concern that these children may be from more than one family, I can't find a burial for the first Richard, I suspect the second Richard is mine, as previously stated. The third Richard has Ellen's maiden name as a second christian name and I believe went on to become a wine merchant in Liverpool and an MP.
I'm looking for opinions as to whether this is the same family. I can't find a marriage which fits with the birth of John 1807, maybe the couple had moved to Lancaster at that stage? I am unhappy about the proximity of Catherine & John's birth. I believe Ellen was around 19 when married so young enough to be having final children around 1807.
Any input very welcome. Thanks, Christine

[rosie99]

The family story, from more than one source, is that he was from Garstang was attracted by the huge herring catches of the time and moved to Poulton-le-Sands (now Morecambe).

William Gardner baptised 1825 at PLS to Richard & Ann was the first child where his fathers occupation was Fisherman.  Prior to that the occupation given was Husbandman.  It took him a while from the first baptism in 1818 to do full time fishing 

[trish1120]

Richard Cardwell Gardners 1828 Marriage is on FreeREG, witnesses Thos Gardner and Mary Bateson
Thos was a witness to Lydias 1823 Marriage.
Maybe not much help with your query though!

[rosie99]

Who were Ann Baxters parents 

[cristeen]

Rosie99, I haven't set great store by the family story although several have turned out to be very accurate. Richard may well have fished for a supplementary income until taking it up full time, there's plenty to learn for a land lubber! I am fairly sure that Ann Baxter's parents were John (1767 Heysham) and Margaret Clark (1760 Dalton in Furness) who were married 1791 at Dalton in Furness
trish1120, Thanks, I have seen a few records for that Richard & tracked him through the censuses.

[rosie99]

I was hoping Richard & Ann followed a naming pattern with their children but that did not seem to happen - first 2 after Ann's parents then a while before Thomas & Ellen/Eleanor 

What bothers me is where were the infant deaths of Thomas/Ellens children being buried.  I would be concerned about the 3 Richards particularly as we know the 3rd one definitely survived.

[cristeen]

Rosie99, this is my concern too. I cannot find another baptism that is even close for my Richard Gardner. My Richard did name a daughter Ellen (8th & 10th of 11) and a son Thomas (11th of 11) but as you say there is no apparent naming pattern, one would expect that some of the older children would be named after Richard's parents. I'm assuming the two eldest were named after Ann's parents. I will have to keep digging and mark Thomas and Ellen as possibles

[rosie99]

Halton PR's on Lancsopc don't seem to have any Gardners around the time Richard was born.  The trouble with around that area they do tend to stray into Cumberland and whilst Lancsopc is brilliant neighbouring counties let us down   

[cristeen]

I'd wholeheartedly agree about Cumberland & Westmorland records, I have a couple of lines in these counties and online records are almost non-existent!
I do wonder whether my Richard had a falling out with his parents, hence a later child baptised Richard Cardwell. I have a few newspaper articles regarding tenancies etc near Lancater but impossible to tell if it's the same Richard or Thomas  Gardner  of course