Author Topic: Maggie Cameron - Noble - Smith (Toronto and area)  (Read 3613 times)

Offline Rosinish

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Re: Maggie Cameron - Noble - Smith (Toronto and area)
« Reply #27 on: Saturday 16 September 17 03:11 BST (UK) »
bbart...

That's very interesting because my next question (before you posted this) was going to be...

She is listed as a domestic worker, living in Toronto, born in Nairn, Scotland, with a relative of brother Joseph Noble, at 3 Simpson St, Nairn, and traveling to a Mrs. Lloyd A Woolley at 112 Herkimer (?) St, Buffalo, New York. Passage paid by a Mrs. McDuffy.

Has anyone checked out Joseph on any census' to see who the parents are & if they match?

Annie
South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie, MacDonald, MacInnes, MacIntyre, MacKinnon, Steele, Walker

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, MacKinnon, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"

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Offline cosmac

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Re: Maggie Cameron - Noble - Smith (Toronto and area)
« Reply #28 on: Saturday 16 September 17 05:41 BST (UK) »
Maggie Cameron from 1901 Scottish census was born Rafford Elginshire (or Moray)
On the 1891 census for Rafford, Moray living at Templestone Cottage is
Jane Cammeron, 20 b. Knockando, Elginshire with daughters
Margaret Cammeron, 3 b. Rafford, and Jane E. 3 months born Rafford.
There is a birth registration on Scotlandspeople for Jane Elizabeth Cameron born 1891 Rafford which would be worth getting

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Offline bbart

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Re: Maggie Cameron - Noble - Smith (Toronto and area)
« Reply #29 on: Saturday 16 September 17 06:55 BST (UK) »
Cosmac, I got a birth registration for a Margaret Cameron that might match what you just posted:

Margaret Cameron born 23 Aug 1888 in Farnalea, Rafford.
Parents: William Cameron, farm servant  and Jane Cameron MS Stephen
Parents married 20 Jul 1888 Rafford
Informant, father William Cameron residing Parkend, Bullet Loan, Forres

(Google says Bullet Loan was renamed, but I forget what it was renamed to, and I'm too lazy to search again  :D )

If it's the right family, maybe something happened to William, and Jane couldn't keep the girls.  Did the census say what Jane's marital status was?

Offline DonM

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Re: Maggie Cameron - Noble - Smith (Toronto and area)
« Reply #30 on: Saturday 16 September 17 13:49 BST (UK) »
Bullet Loan

http://maps.nls.uk/view/74478425 at the very top

Also a current reference https://canmore.org.uk/site/194881/forres-st-leonards-road-general

Haven't read this for a while but will someone be providing a Power Point presentation when this post is completed?

Don



Offline cosmac

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Re: Maggie Cameron - Noble - Smith (Toronto and area)
« Reply #31 on: Saturday 16 September 17 15:00 BST (UK) »
Jane on the 1891 census was a groom's wife

Offline bbart

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Re: Maggie Cameron - Noble - Smith (Toronto and area)
« Reply #32 on: Sunday 17 September 17 06:34 BST (UK) »
Thanks for the map links, Don, and thanks for rechecking on Jane for me, Cosmac.

Offline saraslater

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Re: Maggie Cameron - Noble - Smith (Toronto and area)
« Reply #33 on: Sunday 17 September 17 14:09 BST (UK) »
I'll try to compile all this info into one post, with all the options of who Maggie may be.
I have way more to go on than when I started. Have been working on Maggie not stop for days now!
Thank you all.
Swinbourne, Hunt, Maxwell, Taylor, Williamson, Burt, Cant, Cameron, Leavesly, Cooper, Rankine, Taylor, Anderson

Offline saraslater

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Re: Maggie Cameron - Noble - Smith (Toronto and area)
« Reply #34 on: Tuesday 19 September 17 03:27 BST (UK) »
1 of 2

Hi all,

In case you were still pondering on my Maggie puzzle... I've put together all the facts found by you lovely people as well as what I've found and organized them the best I could.

=====

Maggie
Cameron/Noble Smith
Born 1888, Scotland


Mother of Daisy Edna Swinbourne (nee Noble, Fredenburg). My maternal grandmother.

On Daisy’s birth record shows that Maggie Cameron is her mother and Edward Noble is her father, married in Scotland
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~births/N_Surnames.htm
7502-11 (Toronto) NOBLE, Edna Daisy, f, b. 20 July 1911 at St. Michaels Hospital; father - Edward NOBLE, motorman; mother - Maggie CAMERON; infm - Nellie Lyttle, nurse; parents married - 12 Feb 1906 in Scotland

However, the only Noble/Cameron marriage (which doesn’t fit, so maybe they weren’t really married) in Scotland was:
NOBLE ERNEST EDWARD
HENDERSON ANNIE T
1906
466/ 13
Clackmannan

Daisy was adopted by Hiram John Fredenburg (1878-1929 Ontario) & Sarah Jane Delill (1876-1958) around 1918, and are shown on the Toronto Census:
Hiram J Fredenburg   43 Sarah Fredenburg   43
William H Fredenburg   22 Daisy E Fredenburg 9  Student.

Ancestry tree is showing Edward W Noble born 1886 Fraserburgh, Aberdeenshire to Peter and Jane Noble. 1901 census 32 Mid Street 2 Gordon's Court Aberdeenshire.

Peter Noble   61
Jane Noble   59
Francis R M Noble   25
Alice Noble   24
Henry A Noble   21
Edward W Noble   15

Marriage given as 12 February 1906 Fraserburgh Aberdeenshire.

BUT, Edward married an Isabel and lived in Quebec, Canada. They had a daughter named Isabel and they moved back to Fraserburgh so he could enlist in the war, during which he died in 1918.

I’ve recently been in touch with a relation on this particular Edward, and had her DNA done, and if Edward were my we should be 4th cousins and get a match. We don't.

Maggie then married Henry George Smith on 29 June 1912 in Toronto, Ontario, and they had 2 sons, William Arthur in 1913 and Harold in 1915.

On the marriage certificate, Maggie lists her birthplace as Nairn, Scotland, Henry George’s as Glasgow Scotland. Maggie lists her father as Angus Noble, and mother as Annie Ross.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9Q97-Y399-QQJG?cc=1784216

=====

In Nov. 1909 there is a border crossing (by train) for a Maggie Noble (aged 23, so 2 yrs older than we are looking for).  She is listed as a domestic worker, living in Toronto, born in Nairn, Scotland, with a relative of brother Joseph Noble, at 3 Simpson St, Nairn, and traveling to a Mrs. Lloyd A Woolley at 112 Herkimer (?) St, Buffalo, New York. Passage paid by a Mrs. McDuffy.  However, she was debarred from entering the USA, as she was labelled a criminal.

=====

searching Joseph Noble at 3 Simpson St, Nairn.  In 1901 there was a Margaret Noble (in her 60's) living at that address.  Looking at other people living in the area, and according to Google maps, less than a one minute walk away, at 18 Harbour St. in 1901, is this:

Name:    Angus Noble
Age:    64
Estimated birth year:    abt 1837
Relationship:    Head
Spouse's name :    Annie Noble
Gender:    Male
Where born:    Croy, Invernesshire
County:    Nairnshire
Address:    18 Harbour St
Occupation:    General Labourer
Household Members:   
Angus Noble    64
Annie Noble    50
John Noble    23
Margaret Cameron    13  scholar, boarder, born 1888 in Rafford, Elginshire
George McLeod    28
James Free    30
Thomas Connell    59
William Noble    16

Annie Ross as found on Scotland’s people
http://pardoes.info/jandap2016/2037.htm

If this is Angus Noble and Annie nee Ross, could this be Maggie Cameron that took on their name??

From the thread and combined with my search, we’ve found:

Margaret Cameron born 23 Aug 1888 in Fernalea, Rafford.
Parents: William Cameron, farm servant  and Jane Cameron MS Stephen
Parents married 20 Jul 1888 Rafford
Informant, father William Cameron residing Parkend, Bullet Loan, Forres
(have document downloaded from Scotland’s People)

Parkend Bulletloan Forres:
Forres, St Leonard's Road, General
Formerly named Bullet Loan, as named on 1st edition 1:2500 Elginshire 1870-76.
(Undated) information in NMRS.

Marriage of parents:
20 Jul 1888 in Fernielea
William Cameron 23y Lockshice(?) Rafford -- Farm Servant
Jane Stephen 17y Fernielea, Rafford -- Domestic Servant
Groom’s parents: George Cameron -- Salmonfisher, Margaret Ross -- Fieldworker
Bride’s parent: Jane Cumming
Witnesses: Charles Edward Taylor, James Cameron, Jane Cumming
(have document downloaded from Scotland’s People -- attached)

=====

could be the same Maggie Noble ..Possibility she is the daughter of Robina Priest Cameron
Robina Priest Cameron born 1863 Elgin illegitimate daughter of Margaret Cameron
Robina Priest Cameron married a David McNeill 1889 Elgin
1891 census in Elgin Moray 8 Murdochs Wynd
Robina McNeil age 28 (sick nurse )
Henry H McNeil age 7
Maggie A McNeil age 4 born 1887 Rafford
George McDonald 9 months ( boarder )
Bella McDonald 5 ( boarder )

I was playing around with this, but the facts weren’t fitting for me.
Swinbourne, Hunt, Maxwell, Taylor, Williamson, Burt, Cant, Cameron, Leavesly, Cooper, Rankine, Taylor, Anderson

Offline saraslater

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Re: Maggie Cameron - Noble - Smith (Toronto and area)
« Reply #35 on: Tuesday 19 September 17 03:28 BST (UK) »
2 of 2

Back in Toronto:

Maggie’s 1st (or 2nd?) husband
Henry George Smith:
BIRTH 5 FEB 1883 • Glasgow, Scotland
DEATH Unknown

Sons (my grandmother’s half-brothers)
William Arthur Smith:
BIRTH 15 DEC 1913 • Merritton, Niagara, Ontario, Canada
DEATH 19 FEB 1971 • Toronto, Ontario, Canada

Harold Smith:
BIRTH 1913 • Ontario, Canada
DEATH Unknown

Henry George Smith’s Attestation Papers show Maggie Smith as his next of kin living at the following addresses:
29 Sept 1916 - 52 Pendrith St, Toronto
1 Dec 1917 - 391 Clinton Ave, Toronto
http://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/discover/military-heritage/first-world-war/personnel-records/Pages/item.aspx?IdNumber=237906

Maggie Smith died of Sepsis in 12 Aug 1918 • Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Burial record shows Henry George to live at 391 Clinton Ave, Toronto
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-DRY3-HRJ?cc=1627831

Sometime after Maggie’s Death:

Daisy was adopted by Hiram John Fredenburg (1878-1929 Ontario) & Sarah Jane Delill (1876-1958), and are shown on the 1921 Toronto Census at 104 Pendrith St.:
Hiram J Fredenburg   43 Sarah Fredenburg   43
William H Fredenburg   22 Daisy E Fredenburg 9  Student.

William Arthur, and Harold went to live at the Loyal True Blue and Orange Home

(Step)-dad Henry George, then married Sarah Bertha May Smith in Toronto 01 May 1920.

My grandmother Daisy Edna Noble Fredenburg (as stated on marriage certificate) married my grandfather William Harry Swinbourne on 30 March 1934, and she lists her parents as Edward Fredenburg and Margaret Cameron.

Fredenburg is her adoptive name… so I’m not sure why she’d do that.

William Arthur Smith’s Death notice:
The Globe and Mail (1936-Current); Feb 20, 1971 Pg 49
   SMITH, William Arthur
At his home on Friday, February 19, 1971, William Arthur Smith; dearly beloved husband of Irene Adams, dear father of David William, brother of Daisy (Mrs. Harry Swinbourne) and Harold Smith. Friends may call at the Trull Funeral Home, 1111 Danforth Ave. Funeral service on Monday afternoon at 3 o’clock. Cremation, St. James Crematorium.

==========

So now I’m working on finding out if I can connect the Maggie born to William Cameron and Jane Stephen to the Maggie who was staying with Angus Noble and Annie Ross
Annie’s mother being a Cameron, and William Cameron’s mother being a Ross.

Searching for more information on Maggie here in Toronto, in hopes of finding the father of my grandmother.

Watching this link to see when his full service files are available for the Smiths:
https://thediscoverblog.com/category/digitization-2/

The “Scotland’s People” has been cool. I’ve bought two documents so far.
Swinbourne, Hunt, Maxwell, Taylor, Williamson, Burt, Cant, Cameron, Leavesly, Cooper, Rankine, Taylor, Anderson