Thames Watermen - Length of Time They Were Bound

[venelow]

Hi Rootschatters

I have two questions regarding Thames Watermen:

Firstly, I have found a person of interest in the Transcript of the Binding Records (Cottrell). However the date of birth is blank.  I understand that there were affidavits that gave the age and birthplace of the apprentice. If the DOB or YOB is missing does this mean the Affidavit is not available?  Or if it is where would I find it?

Secondly, I have found a Waterman of the same name in the 1827 list whose YOB computes to circa 1788. If they are the same man, that would make him 16 when apprenticed in 1804, so that seems to be possible. However his release date is in 1816 which makes a twelve year period of being bound.  Is this usual for Watermen? 

Since the person I am tracing had a child in 1811 (mother named but marriage not yet found) would he have been able to marry while still bound? Or am I looking at two people with the same name?

I have not mentioned names as it is my understanding that the Binding List transcript is copyright.

Any insight re these questions would be welcome.
Thank you.

Venelow
Canada

[tonepad]

The normal term of apprenticeship for watermen was seven years after 1603.
It is now five years.

http://watermenscompany.com/the-company/history/

[venelow]

Thank you Tonepad.  That is what I thought. 12 years seems a long time to be bound.

Seven years would make the end of the apprenticeship 1811.  His son was baptized in April 1811.  I don't know how reliable Cottrell's transcript is rated. I can't see how there could be a a misreading of 1811 for 1816.

I have not found the original Bindings records on line.

Venelow
Canada

[tonepad]

Hi Venelow

Have you looked at these sites:

https://search.findmypast.co.uk/search-world-records/thames-watermen-and-lightermen-1688-2010

http://www.parishregister.com/aboutstp.html

As you live in Canada, subscriptions would be required.

regards
Tony

[venelow]

Hi Tony

Thank you for your suggestions.

I have consulted both those sites. The Parish Register has information on finding Watermen and Lightermen ancestors and refers to the Binding Books transcript thus:



" The Apprentice Bindings books (which record the name of the apprentice, the date of binding, the master’s name and mooring, and the date of freedom (i.e when the apprentice having learned his trade, qualified to get his own license) cover the period 1688 to 1949.

The original records are held in the Guildhall Library in London. (Address; Guildhall Library, Aldermanbury, London EC2P 2EJ Tel; 020 7332 1863; www.cityoflondon.gov.uk/guildhalllibrary .

If you are not able to get to the Guildhall, then we offer a number of alternatives.

The binding records entries (over 65,000 of them) have been transcribed by Rob Cottrell and are available in a PDF searchable format on CD-ROM.
This product is available from our Shop. Click here for more information.

Once you have the date and place of birth, you can search the Parish registers to obtain further genealogical information on your family. "



As previously stated I have consulted the Cottrell transcript but the date and place of birth are not recorded
and not just on the person I am looking at but others of the same era. The information transcribed is as described in the first paragraph quoted above.

There seems to be a missing step in the process as it jumps from the Apprentice Binding Books to "once you have the place and date of birth you can search the parish records".

I was hoping someone familiar with the records can tell me where I find the date and place of birth. Was there an Indenture giving the age of the apprentice, place of birth and father's name?  I have also tried the Apprentice Tax Records with no luck.

I have a sub to Find My Past. I didn't realize these were free sites to people living in the UK. Maybe I should get my sister involved.

Venelow

[tonepad]

Findmypast is not generally free in the UK, but free access may be available at local libraries and Family History Societies. There is also occasional free promotional periods.

Tony

[venelow]

Thanks for the explanation. Libraries here tend to go with the other company.

In Canada / US FindMyPast is affiliated with the LDS and one could access the site from a Family History Centre. That used to be the case. Not sure about now as I haven't visited for some time. Of course getting to a FHC is not always an option for many people.

Venelow

[StevieSteve]

There seems to be a missing step in the process as it jumps from the Apprentice Binding Books to "once you have the place and date of birth you can search the parish records".

I was hoping someone familiar with the records can tell me where I find the date and place of birth. Was there an Indenture giving the age of the apprentice, place of birth and father's name? 

Yes, once you have the date of binding, you have to go to Guildhall and find the baptism certificate that I think needed to be provided to show that the applicant was of legitimate birth.

You get to look through a bundle of original certificates so they're not online.

The Binding books don't have the baptism details in the entry. It might even describe someone as 'of somewhere' though that person was baptised elsewhere

[tonepad]

Hi Venelow

I have recently pushed my watermen ancestors back a further two generations.
Last night I searched for my earliest ancestors on the binding records - and like you found gaps in the data available (date and place of birth). So it seems the guidance for using binding records is misleading. My case is not helped by my family having a very common surname and there is usually more than one man with the same name on the records from the same era. I have used census, baptism and marriage records as proof that my ancestors were watermen.

regards
Tony