Author Topic: Missing family after 1881 - PARKINS  (Read 2265 times)

Offline Jang

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Missing family after 1881 - PARKINS
« on: Wednesday 27 September 17 04:03 BST (UK) »
I need help in finding what became of this family after 1881, when they were living at 16 Killermont St, Glasgow.

Charles Parkins, 31, head railyway guard England
Catherine Parkins, 25 wife Kilmadock Perthshire
Kate Parkins  2 dau Glasgow
Charity Jane Parkins  1 dau Glasgow

I can't find them in later censuses in England or Scotland, or their deaths or marriages in the SP index, so possbibly they emigrated.

Any leads gratefully received :-)
Jan
England:
Durham: COULSON, FENWICK, HUNTER, LOWES, NAYLOR, ROBSON
Norfolk: DEWING, OUGHTON, TAYLOR,
Lancashire: TWEDDLE
Ireland: KEATING, Limerick; NELSON, Donegal
Scotland: BENNIE, Glasgow; COOK, Renfrewshire; HENDERSON, Alloa/Dundee; HUNTER, Glasgow; KIRKWOOD, Alloa; LAMONT, Dalkeith; YOUNG, Glasgow
Switzerland: VOSTI, DELUBINI
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

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Offline Kay99

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Re: Missing family after 1881 - PARKINS
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 27 September 17 07:01 BST (UK) »
This may not help but I think the couple married in 1878 in the Gorbols based on the daughter Kate's biirth on Scotland's People.    On the marriage cert Charles is listed as Chandler Parkin/s Railway Yardman with parents William and Charity Parkin/s- spouse Kate Morgan .   

In early census years he is listed as born in 1849 Baldersby, Yorkshire (with middle name James) and married a Grace Grey in Carstairs in 1875 and she died in 1877

Kay

Edit -Found a death on Scotlands People   Chandler James Parkin age 32 - 7 May 1881 at Royal Infirm Glasgow -wife Catherine Morgan - occupation Assistant Railway Inspector- Parents William Morgan - Charity Chandler


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Offline Jang

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Re: Missing family after 1881 - PARKINS
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 27 September 17 07:42 BST (UK) »
Many thanks Kay, it helps a great deal. Chandler? No wonder I couldn't find him. :-)

It means I can eliminate this family from the Charles Parkins I'm researching. I thought he was the same one who married Margaret Moodie in 1870 in Ayr but I couldn't make it fit. That couple had children - William John (1873-1874 Hutchesontown), possibly William Charles (1875 Hutchesontown), Margaret (1876 England, according to the 1881 census) and probably Helen (1877-1877 Hutchesontown).

In 1871 there's a Charles Parkins who was a a Private with 5th Fusiliers at the Infantry Barracks in Ayr, aged 22, born England. I think he's probably the one who married Margaret Moodie 1870 in Ayr.
 
In 1881 Margaret (Moodie) Parkins and daughter Margaret were living with her parents, William and Elizabeth Moodie in Hutchestontown but there's no sign of Charles. Margaret (the mother) died in 1882 in Hutchinsontown but I can't find any trace of her daughter after this date.

Jan
England:
Durham: COULSON, FENWICK, HUNTER, LOWES, NAYLOR, ROBSON
Norfolk: DEWING, OUGHTON, TAYLOR,
Lancashire: TWEDDLE
Ireland: KEATING, Limerick; NELSON, Donegal
Scotland: BENNIE, Glasgow; COOK, Renfrewshire; HENDERSON, Alloa/Dundee; HUNTER, Glasgow; KIRKWOOD, Alloa; LAMONT, Dalkeith; YOUNG, Glasgow
Switzerland: VOSTI, DELUBINI
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Kay99

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Re: Missing family after 1881 - PARKINS
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 27 September 17 07:54 BST (UK) »
I also got confused with the Charles Parkins and Margaret Moodie couple and their children born in the same area as there are so few Parkins .   Charles and Margaret also had a son Charles born 1881 (who I think died) - presumably why she was at home with her parents. 

They don't make it easy do they  :-\

Kay

Offline Jang

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Re: Missing family after 1881 - PARKINS
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 27 September 17 08:06 BST (UK) »
That's for sure!

Just checked on SP - yes, Charles Parkins died 1882 - looks like poor Margaret died in childbirth. Now to find out what happened to her husband and daughter ...

Thanks for your help - it always helps to have a fresh set of eyes :-)

Jan
England:
Durham: COULSON, FENWICK, HUNTER, LOWES, NAYLOR, ROBSON
Norfolk: DEWING, OUGHTON, TAYLOR,
Lancashire: TWEDDLE
Ireland: KEATING, Limerick; NELSON, Donegal
Scotland: BENNIE, Glasgow; COOK, Renfrewshire; HENDERSON, Alloa/Dundee; HUNTER, Glasgow; KIRKWOOD, Alloa; LAMONT, Dalkeith; YOUNG, Glasgow
Switzerland: VOSTI, DELUBINI
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Kay99

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Re: Missing family after 1881 - PARKINS
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 27 September 17 15:43 BST (UK) »
Had a fiddle and I think William Charles Parkin/s born 1875 died the next year in Newcastle upon Tyne

Also found a death of a Maria Parkins age 4 on 28 Sept 1881 parents Charles and Margaret - reported by Elizabeth Moodie - grandmother. I wonder if she was listed as Margaret on the 1881 census ??

Kay

Offline Jang

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Re: Missing family after 1881 - PARKINS
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 28 September 17 02:08 BST (UK) »
Kay, many thanks for the feedback. I think you're right about Maria and Margaret being one and the same - the age, parents and grandmother all fit. Great find! Having William Charles die in Newcastle on Tyne about the same time sister Margaret was born in England gave me a place to search for Margaret(Maria's?) birth. I found a couple of possibilities- Margaret Ann Sep 1875 Tynemouth and Margaret Parkins Mar 1879 Newcastle on Tyne. I favour the second one, even though she's a bit young because of the location - perhaps she was registered late.

I'm a bit confused about Elizabeth Moodie. She was Elizabeth Cook (or McWatt, if illegitimate - her mother married in September 1823) born Ireland between 1822 and 1826, according to the 1841 census. She married William Moodie in 1845 in Neilston Renfrewshire and they had Margaret McWatt Moodie born there in 1846.

In 1861, living in Ayr
Elisabeth Moodie  39 Ireland labourer's wife
Margaret Moodie  12 dau Ireland
William John Moodie  8 son Ireland
Alexander Moodie  4 son Ayrshire
Elisabeth Moodie  6 Mo dau Ayrshire
Susan Mcqueen  18 visitor Stranraer, Wigtonshire servant
William Mcqueen  6 Mo visitor Ayr, Ayrshire

So far, so good. I'm not worried about Margaret's birthplace being given as Ireland - it happened a lot with the Cook family, sometimes Ireland, sometimes Neilston.

The same family in 1881, living in Hutchesontown

William Moodie  60 Ireland general labourer 
Elizabeth Moodie   54 wife Ireland
Alexander Moodie  24 son Ayr warehouse porter
Margaret Moodie  30 dau married Ireland shopwoman
Margaret Parkins  4 granddaughter England

The problem is that Alexander Moodie's birth in 1857 Ayr gives his mother as Eliza McDowell, as does Elisabeth's in 1860 Ayr and another son Thomas born 1862 Ayr. Could Elizabeth Cook/McWatt given a different surname to cover up her illegitmacy or did William Moodie marry 2 Elizabeths?

As you said, it's never easy!

Jan
England:
Durham: COULSON, FENWICK, HUNTER, LOWES, NAYLOR, ROBSON
Norfolk: DEWING, OUGHTON, TAYLOR,
Lancashire: TWEDDLE
Ireland: KEATING, Limerick; NELSON, Donegal
Scotland: BENNIE, Glasgow; COOK, Renfrewshire; HENDERSON, Alloa/Dundee; HUNTER, Glasgow; KIRKWOOD, Alloa; LAMONT, Dalkeith; YOUNG, Glasgow
Switzerland: VOSTI, DELUBINI
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Kay99

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Re: Missing family after 1881 - PARKINS
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 28 September 17 05:55 BST (UK) »
Have you checked the GRO Birth Index which lists the mother's maiden name for Margaret/Maria's birth https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/indexes_search.asp   You have to register but it is  free to search.   I can't see a Parkin/s -Moodie birth at the moment sadly

Given all three children born in Scotland have the mother's maiden name I favour there being a second wife - possibly!!  Or maybe Margaret was born on Ireland  and the marriage you found isnot the couple   :-\  Have you found a marriage for any of these children which should list their mother's maiden name or Elizabeth's death cert?? 

Wonder where they were in 1871?   The only possible one I can see is a Alex Moodie age 13 in a ragged school at Carrick St, Ayr??   :-[

Kay

Edit -  Just found  a marriage for Elizabeth - Hutchinson - 5 March 1880 to Joseph Platt.   Elizabeth is listed as 19 with parents William Moodie and Elizabeth McDowell  Witnesses John Wright and Margaret Moodie   - And on the Margeret Moonie's marriage cert in 1870 to Charles Perkins she also lists her mother's maiden name as McDowell??

And a death for William Moodie which also lists his wife's maiden name as McDowall

Offline Jang

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Re: Missing family after 1881 - PARKINS
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 28 September 17 09:06 BST (UK) »
Wow, Kay, I didn't expect you to get the certificate, many thanks for finding William Moodie's death. I had the same thought as you about him marrying twice and Eliza(beth) McDowell being his second wife - what made me reconsider was the fact that little Margaret Parkins is the daughter of Margaret Moodie, who seems to be a good fit for my Margaret McWatt Moodie. Then when you found Elizabeth Moodie listed as Margaret Parkins' grandmother, it made me think again, although I guess a stepgrandmother would be listed as just grandmother.

Thanks for reminding me about the new GRO index. When nothing came up for Margaret Parkins' birth, I checked the William Charles' death you found. Turns out he was aged 15, so not the right one. Went back to search for Margaret/Maria Parkins' birth again, anywhere in England, but nothing had mother's maiden name as Moodie.

There seems to be a gap of 7 years between Margaret McWatt Moodie's birth in 1846 and William John Moodie's in 1853, but both in Ireland, according to the census. William John Moodie married Helen McFarlane - I was told that his mother was listed on the marriage certificate as Elizabeth McDowell too. He had a son, William Porter Moodie born 1878 Glasgow which fits with the parents on William Moodie's death certificate. So it's possible the first Elizabeth (if there was one) died in Ireland and William Moodie married Eliza McDowell between 1846 and 1853 in Ireland.

I think you're probably right about the Margaret Moodie in the 1861 and 1881 census not being my Margaret McWatt Moodie. She was born 1846:

William Moodie and Elisabeth Cook, spouses, Barrhead, had their first child being a daughter born on 27th December 1846 and baptised at the Manse on the sixth of May named Margaret McWatt (Moodie)

and the one in the 1861 census is born c1849 and in 1881 census is born c1851. Not exactly a good fit.

I couldn't find them in 1871 either - only Alex. Nor can I find a death for an Elizabeth Moodie after 1881 that fits. The Margaret Parkins who died in 1881 Hutchesontown age 31 so born ca 1850 also fits with the census ages.

Thanks for letting me use you as a sounding board - I really appreciate the feedback. :-)

Back to the drawing board :-)

Jan
England:
Durham: COULSON, FENWICK, HUNTER, LOWES, NAYLOR, ROBSON
Norfolk: DEWING, OUGHTON, TAYLOR,
Lancashire: TWEDDLE
Ireland: KEATING, Limerick; NELSON, Donegal
Scotland: BENNIE, Glasgow; COOK, Renfrewshire; HENDERSON, Alloa/Dundee; HUNTER, Glasgow; KIRKWOOD, Alloa; LAMONT, Dalkeith; YOUNG, Glasgow
Switzerland: VOSTI, DELUBINI
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk