Samuel DOWNING, 1787-1864

[Watson]

I'm interested in Samuel DOWNING, who was baptised at Tibshelf, Derbyshire, in 1787.

By 1817, he was a game-keeper at Ditchley Lodge, Oxfordshire.  He and his wife, Amy, had several children baptised at Spelsbury, 1817-1824.

Two of these, Samuel George and Joseph Godfrey, became apprenticed to masters in Astbury, near Congleton, Cheshire, to a surgeon and a chemist, respectively.

I now have a gap in Samuel's life until 1838, when he was a publican at the Black Horse, Bedfordbury (Covent Garden).  The 1841 census finds Samuel and Amy at 76 Snow Hill, London, which seems to have been the address of the "Cock" (run by George Clay in 1839).  Later Samuel ran the "Red Lion" in Rosoman Street, Clerkenwell, but by the 1851 census he was a retired publican.

Amy died in 1863 in the West Ham reg. district, and Samuel died in 1864 at Gislingham, Suffolk, neither leaving a will.

I would like to fill in the gap in Samuel DOWNING's life between 1824 and 1838, especially information about any further children.  Was he perhaps in Astbury some of that time, where two sons were apprenticed?

Details of his marriage to Amy would also be of interest.

Thanks and regards.

[maddys52]

It seems to me that you know quite a bit about Samuel already 

There are references to him as gamekeeper in Jackson's Oxford Journal in 1818, 1826 and 1827 - so still in Oxfordshire then. Also he's advertising for a lost horse May 16, 1818 - I could attach a copy of these if you don't already have them?

[maddys52]

I wonder if this is their marriage?

Samuel DOWNING bachelor of Spelsbury, Oxfordshire to Amelia HUDSON, spinster of St George Hanover Square by licence, 12 July 1814. At St George, Hanover Square

(On Free Reg)

I know the 1851 census shows Amy's place of birth as Clifton, Yorkshire, but she may have been living in London in 1814.

[dcbnwh]

There is a baptism of Amy Hudson, daughter of George of Clifton, in Conisbrough, Yorkshire, on 3rd March 1776.

David

[Watson]

Many thanks, maddys52.  The marriage is a very welcome find.  It must be the right one, as it is most unlikely there were two Samuel Downings in Spelsbury.  I wonder how they met.  Samuel's father was a farmer in Tibshelf, Derbyshire.

The entries in Jackson's Oxford Journal sound interesting, and I will look them up shortly.

Thank you also to dcbnwh.  The baptism fits well in some respects, but I am worried about the date, 3rd March 1776.  The last baptism at Spelsbury was on 14th March 1824, which would mean that Amy was 48.

Best regards.

[dcbnwh]

It does seem to be quite old to give birth but not impossible, although she would have been 'creative' with her age when she married. My great grandmother was alway five years younger on the censuses after her marriage.

This is the baptism on Familysearch but it has been transcribed incorrectly as Ann.

A brother - https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NYQ1-YQ2

Parents' marriage - https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NXCY-N5M

David

[maddys52]

Whilst I can't see any suitable baptisms straight away, I think I agree that the one David found sounds a bit early. She is definitely recorded as 65 in the 1851 census, so born around 1786, which fits with the 1841 too. Although I agree too that ages could well be fudged. 

What are the names of Samuel and Amy's children that you have?

[maddys52]

Just back to Samuel - death notice which you might already have:
"Downing - 23rd inst, at Gislingham, Suffolk, Mr Samuel Downing, late of Rayne, in his 78th year"

Chelmsford Chronicle, Friday, April 29, 1864, Issue 5172, p.3.
and Essex Standard, Friday, April 29, 1864, Vol. 34, Issue 1741.

And in the 1861 Samuel is at Rayne St, Rayne. And now his wife's age is 78, so born c1783 ... getting earlier. 

[dcbnwh]

The only death record I can find for Amy Downing after 1861 does give her birth as 1775. May not be the right person but it would mean buying the death certificate to be certain.

DOWNING, AMY age 88
GRO Reference: 1863 D Quarter in WEST HAM UNION Volume 04A Page 26

David