Author Topic: Trinity Church Dewsbury & HUGGINS  (Read 361 times)

Offline cavair

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Trinity Church Dewsbury & HUGGINS
« on: Saturday 14 October 17 20:12 BST (UK) »
Many thanks to people who replied to another thread on HUGGINS family. 

I now have a marriage certificate at Trinity Church on Dec 25, 1875 for Charles HUGGINS & Mary Elizabeth BROOKE.
However its says married according to the rites of the Independents, not CofE. so I googled Trinity it came up with Holy Trinity, presumably an anglican church. So who was Trinity, or are they the same? And why Independents?

Will be grateful for info on the church and where it is/was !
Thankyou.
BANKS -North Yorks/Durham;  ORD - Durham;  WALKERLEY / HUGGINS / KING - Lincs;   CAVILL - Bristol;

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Online arthurk

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Re: Trinity Church Dewsbury & HUGGINS
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 14 October 17 20:28 BST (UK) »
If it says "According to the rites of the Independents" then it will have taken place in an Independent chapel, not Church of England.

Looking at the ancient parish of Dewsbury in the National Index of Parish Registers, I can't see an Independent Chapel called Trinity, so I wonder if there's anything else on the certificate to say where it was. It might be that it was in the Dewsbury Registration District rather than in the town/ancient parish itself.

There's more on the extent of the registration district at https://www.ukbmd.org.uk/reg/districts/dewsbury.html
Researching among others:
Bartle, Bilton, Campbell, Craven, Emmott, Harcourt, Hirst, Kellet(t), Kennedy,
Meaburn, Mennile/Meynell, Metcalf(e), Palliser, Robinson, Rutter, Shipley, Stow, Wilkinson

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

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Offline Daisypetal

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Re: Trinity Church Dewsbury & HUGGINS
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 15 October 17 19:43 BST (UK) »

Hi,

I think I have found the Chapel :)


I found the marriage in "West Yorkshire, Non-Conformist Records, 1646-1985",

Parish or Chapel:  Dewsbury
 
Dec 25 1875
Charles HUGGINS    23    Bachelor    Teamer?   
Residence:  Dewsbury
Father:  Charles HUGGINS

Mary Elizabeth BROOKS    22    Spinster     
Residence:  Webster St. Dewsbury
Father:  Joseph BROOKS

Officiating minister:  A. A. RAMSEY


In 1881 an Adam Averell RAMSEY is living in Dewsbury , his occupation is Independent Minister Trinity Church.

Here it mentions,
PLACES OF WORSHIP, "Congregational (Trinity), Wellington road, Rev. Adam Averell Ramsey, minister; Sun. 10.30 & 6, Thur. 7.30."

http://forebears.co.uk/england/yorkshire/dewsbury

There is some info about it here,

http://www.longcauseway.org.uk/about-us/page1/

as it was "demolished in 1985 to make way for the ring road." it's lucky that there seems to be a picture here,

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01kwi/


Just for interest, it seem that Adam Averell RAMSEY wrote some books including,

"Co-operative Congress - Dewsbury - 1888: Sermon preached in Trinity Congregational Chapel, Dewsbury, on Whit-Sunday morning, May 20th"

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01kwj/


Hope this helps :)
 
Regards,
Daisy
All Census Data included in this post is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)

Online arthurk

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Re: Trinity Church Dewsbury & HUGGINS
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 15 October 17 20:13 BST (UK) »
Well done, Daisy - I thought I'd looked at those non-conformist registers but maybe I had a typo in my search or something. And the chapel is listed in the NIPR, as Congregational rather than Independent. (They were fairly similar.)

You've found some useful information and an impressive picture. Here's a map as well:
http://maps.nls.uk/view/125646071 (you might need to zoom in)

The chapel is near the NE corner, just where the railway crosses Halifax Road.
Researching among others:
Bartle, Bilton, Campbell, Craven, Emmott, Harcourt, Hirst, Kellet(t), Kennedy,
Meaburn, Mennile/Meynell, Metcalf(e), Palliser, Robinson, Rutter, Shipley, Stow, Wilkinson

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Daisypetal

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Re: Trinity Church Dewsbury & HUGGINS
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 15 October 17 20:29 BST (UK) »
Looking back at my search (on Ancestry) I had put a +/-1 year for the marriage and it comes up under 1876, sorry I hadn't noticed.

Looking at the image it is a bit different, 1875 has the last entry of Nov 13th then 1876 starts, the Dec 25th entry for Charles and Mary is at the bottom of the page under 1876 Jun 3rd, the next page starts with 1876 Jul 3rd. It looks like 25th Dec has been written over something else. I can't make it out,





All Census Data included in this post is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)

Online arthurk

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Re: Trinity Church Dewsbury & HUGGINS
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 17 October 17 19:16 BST (UK) »
I think it originally said Date Uncertain, then Dec 25th has been written over it.

What I suspect happened is that part way through 1876 they remembered that the marriage had taken place, and put it in the register but without the exact date. Then someone remembered the date, and it was added later. Ancestry, in the absence of any other evidence to hand, transcribed it as 25 Dec 1876, which is certainly what it appears to be.

However, this cannot be correct, since the registration, which would have happened at the time of the ceremony, was in the December quarter of 1875. Incidentally, the GRO index has BROOKE rather than BROOKS, and I think that's what the register says too.

Useful though it is, it must be remembered that this isn't an "official" marriage register as prescribed by law, but the chapel's own register. (Note that there is no record of witnesses, and an official register would have been filled in when the marriage took place.) Many non-conformist churches relied on registrars to come and register marriages; they brought the official books with them, and only these can form the basis of marriage certificates.

Looking back towards the beginning of the register, it confirms that it belongs to Trinity Conregational Church, Dewsbury. "Rites of the Independents" on the certificate would have been written in the official register, almost certainly by the registrar, and he might have made a mistake or been unintentionally vague.
Researching among others:
Bartle, Bilton, Campbell, Craven, Emmott, Harcourt, Hirst, Kellet(t), Kennedy,
Meaburn, Mennile/Meynell, Metcalf(e), Palliser, Robinson, Rutter, Shipley, Stow, Wilkinson

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline cavair

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Re: Trinity Church Dewsbury & HUGGINS
« Reply #6 on: Friday 20 October 17 10:50 BST (UK) »
I think it originally said Date Uncertain, then Dec 25th has been written over it.

What I suspect happened is that part way through 1876 they remembered that the marriage had taken place, and put it in the register but without the exact date. Then someone remembered the date, and it was added later. Ancestry, in the absence of any other evidence to hand, transcribed it as 25 Dec 1876, which is certainly what it appears to be.

However, this cannot be correct, since the registration, which would have happened at the time of the ceremony, was in the December quarter of 1875. Incidentally, the GRO index has BROOKE rather than BROOKS, and I think that's what the register says too.

Thankyou for your replies and all the info. Much appreciated.  !
BANKS -North Yorks/Durham;  ORD - Durham;  WALKERLEY / HUGGINS / KING - Lincs;   CAVILL - Bristol;

Offline cavair

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Re: Trinity Church Dewsbury & HUGGINS
« Reply #7 on: Friday 20 October 17 10:52 BST (UK) »

Hi,

I think I have found the Chapel :)


I found the marriage in "West Yorkshire, Non-Conformist Records, 1646-1985",

Parish or Chapel:  Dewsbury
 
Dec 25 1875
Charles HUGGINS    23    Bachelor    Teamer?   
Residence:  Dewsbury
Father:  Charles HUGGINS

Mary Elizabeth BROOKS    22    Spinster     
Residence:  Webster St. Dewsbury
Father:  Joseph BROOKS

Officiating minister:  A. A. RAMSEY


In 1881 an Adam Averell RAMSEY is living in Dewsbury , his occupation is Independent Minister Trinity Church.

Here it mentions,
PLACES OF WORSHIP, "Congregational (Trinity), Wellington road, Rev. Adam Averell Ramsey, minister; Sun. 10.30 & 6, Thur. 7.30."

http://forebears.co.uk/england/yorkshire/dewsbury

There is some info about it here,

http://www.longcauseway.org.uk/about-us/page1/

as it was "demolished in 1985 to make way for the ring road." it's lucky that there seems to be a picture here,

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01kwi/


Just for interest, it seem that Adam Averell RAMSEY wrote some books including,

"Co-operative Congress - Dewsbury - 1888: Sermon preached in Trinity Congregational Chapel, Dewsbury, on Whit-Sunday morning, May 20th"

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01kwj/


Hope this helps :)
 
Regards,
Daisy

Thanks for your help! Much appreciated!
BANKS -North Yorks/Durham;  ORD - Durham;  WALKERLEY / HUGGINS / KING - Lincs;   CAVILL - Bristol;