Author Topic: eloping to Rotherham, 1800s  (Read 891 times)

Offline student325

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 92
    • View Profile
Re: eloping to Rotherham, 1800s
« Reply #9 on: Tuesday 17 October 17 07:29 BST (UK) »
Thanks KG. My thoughts entirely. I have written to Rotherham Family History Society as I really would like to know if this happened a lot in Rotherham. If you know the town you'll see the quality of the registers compared with Sheffield and wonder about record keeping/ banns records in total. If no one knows anything about Rotherham, I think I'll need to close this topic.
SOM: CREED, HAINE, MURROW, BOND, PORTCH
CRN: SHUGG, BOWDEN, PEARCE, TREWHELLA, HARRIS, HUNTER, RODDA, LOWRY, MARSHALL, BURN, STEPHENS
GLA/CARM: MORTON, MORGAN, EVANS (CADOXTON)
MON: EVANS (BASSALEG)
PEM: FRANCIS, PHILLIPS
DBY: CARLINE, FOX, BAGSHAW, ROBINSON
NBL: GIBSON, DODD, CHARLTON, HEPPELL
CUM: DODD, MOSES
WES: AIREY, BARNETT, MELLRAY, HOLME
NFK: SMITH, FLOWERS, LAIN, MANSER, LANE
IRE: WALSH, CLEARY, DAWSON, CARROLL
.... Yes I am a mongrel!

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline sallyyorks

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,048
    • View Profile
Re: eloping to Rotherham, 1800s
« Reply #10 on: Tuesday 17 October 17 09:39 BST (UK) »
It wasn't unusual for people to migrate for work into the nearby industrial districts from Derbyshire.

Also the date (marr 1808) is during the Peninsular Wars and also some industrial unrest (Luddites etc).
He might have been in the army or militia and based at some point in or near Rotherham.

Could you give us the names for this couple? It might make it easier to understand what was happening

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline student325

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 92
    • View Profile
Re: eloping to Rotherham, 1800s
« Reply #11 on: Tuesday 17 October 17 17:26 BST (UK) »
Thanks. RootsChat is absolutely amazing for unraveling family trees. In this case I really need specific info on the town of Rotherham. Fear not I will return with a more family history type question (rather than local history question) soon. Thanks for all the ideas nonetheless.
SOM: CREED, HAINE, MURROW, BOND, PORTCH
CRN: SHUGG, BOWDEN, PEARCE, TREWHELLA, HARRIS, HUNTER, RODDA, LOWRY, MARSHALL, BURN, STEPHENS
GLA/CARM: MORTON, MORGAN, EVANS (CADOXTON)
MON: EVANS (BASSALEG)
PEM: FRANCIS, PHILLIPS
DBY: CARLINE, FOX, BAGSHAW, ROBINSON
NBL: GIBSON, DODD, CHARLTON, HEPPELL
CUM: DODD, MOSES
WES: AIREY, BARNETT, MELLRAY, HOLME
NFK: SMITH, FLOWERS, LAIN, MANSER, LANE
IRE: WALSH, CLEARY, DAWSON, CARROLL
.... Yes I am a mongrel!

Offline MagicMirror

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 92
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: eloping to Rotherham, 1800s
« Reply #12 on: Sunday 22 October 17 21:34 BST (UK) »
I have many ancestors from South Yorkshire and I have the impression (not hard evidence unfortunately) that Rotherham was indeed where couples went when they didn't want too many questions asked. One of my 3x gt grandmothers was 15 when she married there in 1851.

Some of the local experts at www.sheffieldindexers.com will probably be able to answer your question.

Online dobfarm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 7,274
  • Scarcliffe village Derbyshire
    • View Profile
Re: eloping to Rotherham, 1800s
« Reply #13 on: Monday 23 October 17 18:57 BST (UK) »
Is there a C of E parish or Quaker or Jewish record of this marriage in Rotherham 1808, was it by banns or special  licence where parents consent was given to miners, from 12 for girls-14 for boys upwards to marry. Rotherham may have been the grooms parish or where he worked. The girl could have lied about her age at marriage if she was very well developed for her age at 15.
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Any transcription of information does not identify or prove anything.
Intended as a Guide only in ancestry research.-It is up to the reader as to any Judgment of assessments of information given! to check from original sources.

In my opinion the marriage residence is not always the place of birth. Never forget Workhouse and overseers accounts records of birth

Offline student325

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 92
    • View Profile
Re: eloping to Rotherham, 1800s
« Reply #14 on: Monday 23 October 17 23:48 BST (UK) »
Thank you MagicMirror for the required local input. I have since found that my forebear (4x great) was third in line in terms of teen marriages. She was 15, her mother barely 17, and her father's mother just 16. They married in Dudley, Chesterfield and Rotherham, and I particularly was wondering about Rotherham and its lack of fuss (or obvious banns!). I will try the good folk at Sheffield Indexers as no reply forthcoming from the family history society. Cheers.
SOM: CREED, HAINE, MURROW, BOND, PORTCH
CRN: SHUGG, BOWDEN, PEARCE, TREWHELLA, HARRIS, HUNTER, RODDA, LOWRY, MARSHALL, BURN, STEPHENS
GLA/CARM: MORTON, MORGAN, EVANS (CADOXTON)
MON: EVANS (BASSALEG)
PEM: FRANCIS, PHILLIPS
DBY: CARLINE, FOX, BAGSHAW, ROBINSON
NBL: GIBSON, DODD, CHARLTON, HEPPELL
CUM: DODD, MOSES
WES: AIREY, BARNETT, MELLRAY, HOLME
NFK: SMITH, FLOWERS, LAIN, MANSER, LANE
IRE: WALSH, CLEARY, DAWSON, CARROLL
.... Yes I am a mongrel!

Offline KGarrad

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,585
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: eloping to Rotherham, 1800s
« Reply #15 on: Tuesday 24 October 17 08:11 BST (UK) »
You only have to be resident in a parish for 3 or 4 weeks for banns to be called.
Or, should I say, allegedly resident!

Even today, when you apply for an Intention to Marry, you need to be resident at the address for just 7 nights (I think?).

The last time I was married, I was actually living in The Netherlands.
So, I temporarily moved into my daughter's home for the relevant time, before visiting the Registrar and getting the Intention to Marry.

A similar situation would happen in years gone by.
Garrad (Suffolk, Essex, Somerset), Crocker (Somerset), Vanstone (Devon, Jersey), Sims (Wiltshire), Bridger (Kent)

Offline Guy Etchells

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 3,509
    • View Profile
Re: eloping to Rotherham, 1800s
« Reply #16 on: Tuesday 24 October 17 08:37 BST (UK) »
It was reasonably common for couples to travel to other parishes where they weren't known, in order to marry without anyone raising objections.

The whole purpose of calling banns over 3 successive weeks, is to allow such objections.
If nobody knows who you are, then who is going to raise an objection?

This is a common misconception, there is and never has been a requirement to call banns on successive or consecutive weeks.

The requirement is simply to call banns "upon three Sundays preceding the Solemnization of Marriage".

I would also add that for marriages by banns or by licence, there was no requirement to provide proof of the residence in the parish for 4 weeks prior to the marriage either.

Cheers
Guy
http://anguline.co.uk/Framland/index.htm   The site that gives you facts not promises!
http://burial-inscriptions.co.uk Tombstones & Monumental Inscriptions.

As we have gained from the past, we owe the future a debt, which we pay by sharing today.

Online dobfarm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 7,274
  • Scarcliffe village Derbyshire
    • View Profile
Re: eloping to Rotherham, 1800s
« Reply #17 on: Tuesday 24 October 17 10:16 BST (UK) »
With trying to attain an exact date of birth or year prior to July 1837 thoses days, unless lucky enough to have a date of birth on a baptism or nonconformist record, as I said earlier girls by 15 to 18 years old can look/act more adult in years, and going to a place or parish the couple or more the underage minor was not known seems the likely situation of fibs about age being told - rather than Rotherham being another Gretna Green

ps: My own dad lied about his age at marriage, telling mum he was same age as her at 31, but he was really 28, mum only found out dads real age when he had to work 3 years longer when mum got to 65 and dad should have also retired on state pension the same year she thought. ;D
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Any transcription of information does not identify or prove anything.
Intended as a Guide only in ancestry research.-It is up to the reader as to any Judgment of assessments of information given! to check from original sources.

In my opinion the marriage residence is not always the place of birth. Never forget Workhouse and overseers accounts records of birth