Author Topic: Suttling House, St Jamesís Palace.  (Read 1955 times)

Online hanes teulu

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 4,600
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Suttling House, St Jamesís Palace.
« Reply #18 on: Thursday 26 October 17 13:54 BST (UK) »
"Lockie's Topography of London 1810" (google books) pinpoints the Adjutant General's Office.  Location still good for 1841 is the question?
S. Wales, Somerset, Devon - Oxenham

Aberavon - Hopkin/s, Jenkins, Thomas
St. Brides/Wick - Jenkins
Llanblethian -† Price
Abergwynfi -† Han(d)ford
Pontardawe -† Lewis.

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline Iain...

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 379
    • View Profile
Re: Suttling House, St Jamesís Palace.
« Reply #19 on: Thursday 26 October 17 13:56 BST (UK) »
Iíve just compared your 1857 map with Google and it looks like the Foreign & Commonwealth Office was constructed on the site of all 4 streets, just next to the Cenotaph.
 
Unless of course ĎUpperí Charles Street was elsewhere.
McArthur - Campbeltown and Tiree Scotland
Black - Campbeltown Scotland - Rathlin Ireland
MacFarlane - Tiree
Wood / Boorman / Gimber / Lee... KENT
Dennett / Mase / Varrier /  Over... KENT

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Online hanes teulu

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 4,600
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Suttling House, St Jamesís Palace.
« Reply #20 on: Thursday 26 October 17 18:22 BST (UK) »
Have you checked "Lockie's"? The GPS of its day.
S. Wales, Somerset, Devon - Oxenham

Aberavon - Hopkin/s, Jenkins, Thomas
St. Brides/Wick - Jenkins
Llanblethian -† Price
Abergwynfi -† Han(d)ford
Pontardawe -† Lewis.

Online hanes teulu

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 4,600
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Suttling House, St Jamesís Palace.
« Reply #21 on: Friday 27 October 17 08:55 BST (UK) »
Finally, had time to read the British History online item. It mentions the proposed location of the Sutling (one "l") House in the 1750 rebuild of the principal ("middle") Horseguards building and its being abolished 1851.
S. Wales, Somerset, Devon - Oxenham

Aberavon - Hopkin/s, Jenkins, Thomas
St. Brides/Wick - Jenkins
Llanblethian -† Price
Abergwynfi -† Han(d)ford
Pontardawe -† Lewis.

Online hanes teulu

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 4,600
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Suttling House, St Jamesís Palace.
« Reply #22 on: Friday 27 October 17 09:34 BST (UK) »
...Horseguards building and its being abolished 1851.

London Daily News, 16 Sep 1854
"Two or three years since a sutling house was removed from the South Wing of the Horse Guards structure and the court yard adjoining it built upon ..."
S. Wales, Somerset, Devon - Oxenham

Aberavon - Hopkin/s, Jenkins, Thomas
St. Brides/Wick - Jenkins
Llanblethian -† Price
Abergwynfi -† Han(d)ford
Pontardawe -† Lewis.

Offline Iain...

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 379
    • View Profile
Re: Suttling House, St Jamesís Palace.
« Reply #23 on: Saturday 28 October 17 17:47 BST (UK) »
Hanes (Forgive me, I suppose thatís your first name) a hundred thanks !

Iím a member of the British Newspaper Archive so Iíll research that item.
As for LockieÖ, I compared it with todays Google Maps and the streets near Downing Street have been demolished to make way for the Foreign and Commonwealth Office; just opposite the Cenotaph.  But...  But 'Upper Charles Street' is not apparent !!(?)

In the meantime, I've been researching a certain Guardsman called George Osborne who married in Belgium two months before the Battle. (Brice would have known him) 
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=768744.msg6244251#msg6244251
With no luck, I decided to contact my Regiment and ask the Chaplain for assistance.
Ken provided a mountain of information and whatís more, thanks to him, the Church of England replied to help with the inquiry.

Ken found himself at Saint Jamesís palace the other day and before leaving for Aldershot, he popped into RHQ WelliB where F Company is billeted. (F Company is the 'remnants' of my 2nd Battalion and that of Brice McGregor.  The Battalion being reduced to Company strength, they continue to maintain the 2SG Colours.
During his visit, the CO seemed to be extremely interested and Ken wrote the following reply:
ďIain,
Me again. The F-Coy Commander has been quite proactive on this and the Officers' Mess Colour Sergeant at St. James' Palace is asking around the Royal Household for you!Ē

Another Freemasonry source is that Brice was a ĎPM&T.í (Past Master and Tyler)   Tyler, meaning that he stood guard by the door with sword in hand, barring anyone who was not a Masson.
LolÖ, and the soup thickens.

I only hope that F Company can find a drawing of the suttling house !   It seems illogical that the Officer's Mess at a 90į angle to the suttling house does not have a drawing or painting somewhere;
Keeping my fingers crossed !
McArthur - Campbeltown and Tiree Scotland
Black - Campbeltown Scotland - Rathlin Ireland
MacFarlane - Tiree
Wood / Boorman / Gimber / Lee... KENT
Dennett / Mase / Varrier /  Over... KENT

Online hanes teulu

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 4,600
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Suttling House, St Jamesís Palace.
« Reply #24 on: Saturday 28 October 17 20:30 BST (UK) »
There's earlier mention in this post about the Sutling House, St. James' Palace - that of the Kings' Guard I believe.

Check the Morning Advertiser, 26 Sep 1834, re. "Joseph Ayling".

Best of luck with the search
S. Wales, Somerset, Devon - Oxenham

Aberavon - Hopkin/s, Jenkins, Thomas
St. Brides/Wick - Jenkins
Llanblethian -† Price
Abergwynfi -† Han(d)ford
Pontardawe -† Lewis.

Offline Iain...

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 379
    • View Profile
Re: Suttling House, St Jamesís Palace.
« Reply #25 on: Sunday 29 October 17 05:56 GMT (UK) »
Lol...   More confusion as this indicates Saint James's Palace and not Horse Guards.
The Colour Sergeant doing some research there may come across it.

In the meantime, it does show that the suttling houses did have strict opening hours, despite their raison díÍtre !

Thank you for that...  ;)

McArthur - Campbeltown and Tiree Scotland
Black - Campbeltown Scotland - Rathlin Ireland
MacFarlane - Tiree
Wood / Boorman / Gimber / Lee... KENT
Dennett / Mase / Varrier /  Over... KENT

Online hanes teulu

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 4,600
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Suttling House, St Jamesís Palace.
« Reply #26 on: Sunday 29 October 17 08:28 GMT (UK) »
As I read it -

Joseph Ayling ran the sutling house in St Jame's Palace - the Kings Guards.
Brice ran the sutling house on Horseguards - the Foot Guards. His predecessor was a Mr Childes?
S. Wales, Somerset, Devon - Oxenham

Aberavon - Hopkin/s, Jenkins, Thomas
St. Brides/Wick - Jenkins
Llanblethian -† Price
Abergwynfi -† Han(d)ford
Pontardawe -† Lewis.