Combusnethan Wishaw releif

[elricks]

Good evening all from Australia.

I have just uncovered a number of Chr from the above church 1837-c1850.  I have confirmed the parents as Thomas SMITH AND e??? ROBERTSON.  The mother's name is always a little different Eles, Elizabeth, etc.

I can't find a marriage anywhere, and I notice that the marriage register for Wishaw relief is not mentioned as being transcribed.

Could someone with inside knowledge please tell me the circumstances surrounding the recording of marriages in this church around 1835-1838. Were there any?  If yes, what happened to the register. If there were not, where would I be likely to find a marriage of a couple who were obviously Presbyterian (an assumption on my part, as the children were Chr in this and another Presbyterian church in Lanarkshire)

Thanks - SHIRLEY

[Forfarian]

According to Diane Baptie's Registers of the Secession Churches in Scotland the only surviving records from Wishaw (Wishawtown), Relief, UP, Thornlie UF, C of S are deaths 1835-46 and baptisms 1831-64. So the reason the marriages from this congregation have not been transcribed is that either they never existed, or they have been lost.

It is reasonable to suppose that they were Presbyterian, because most* Christian denominations except the Roman Catholic and Episcopal churches in Scotland were Presbyterian. That includes, specifically, the Church of Scotland, which is sometimes described as 'the Established Church'. 'Presbyterian' does not define the beliefs of a particular sect or denomination. It describes the hierarchy of that denomination.

The Roman Catholic and Episcopalian churches have hierarchies of bishops, but there are no bishops in Presbyterian churches. Each congregation has a Kirk Session, which is a committee made up of minister and elders. The next tier is the Presbytery, which is a committee made up of the ministers and (usually) one elder representing each Kirk Session. Then comes the Synod, which is a grouping of Presbyteries, and ultimately the General Assembly, which comprises the ministers and representative elders from all the congregations of that denomination.

*There were some Methodist, Baptist and Congregational congregations, but I am not au fait with the internal organisation of these denominations.

[carlineric]

Another complication is that until 1939 the banns for ALL marriages no matter what the denomination had to be called in the parish church of each of the participants. The parish church is that of the Church of Scotland. You do find occasionally the recording of banns for people of other denominations in the OPRs. As an example when one set of my grandparents married in 1926 my grandfather's banns were recorded in the parish church where he lived, similarly my grandmother's. But they were married by a United Free Church minister as my grandmother was a member of the United Free Church.

Eric

[RJ_Paton]

The Relief Church or to give it its correct title "The Presbytery of Relief" was an early dissenting church group which broke away from the Church of Scotland over Patronage (the appointing of a minister by the local laird against the wishes of the congregation). Later many of these congregations joined with those from the United Secession Church to form the United Presbyterian's - although there were still some who went their own way and others who rejoined the Church of Scotland.

Another complication is that until 1939 the banns for ALL marriages no matter what the denomination had to be called in the parish church of each of the participants.

That may have been done by some but it was not a legal requirement and had not been since the Marriage Notice (Scotland) Act of 1878 which remained in force until replaced with the Marriage (Scotland) Act of 1977.

In theory until 1843 as the Church of Scotland was responsible for the Poor Relief the local Minister  was charged with recording all details of Births Marriages and Deaths in their area regardless of denomination - some did, many did not and in addition as no particular importance was placed on these records their care was never a high priority.

[elricks]

Thanks you all for that wonderful insight. Exactly what I needed so I can understand and can explain to others.