Author Topic: What conclusions can be made from this mid-1800s book inscription?  (Read 1136 times)

Offline Tim Shortt

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What conclusions can be made from this mid-1800s book inscription?
« on: Wednesday 08 November 17 04:29 GMT (UK) »
This old book is about the only keepsake that has passed down in this branch of my family. In the early 1900s it found its way to Toronto. It carries these two inscriptions:

Presented by her Father to/ Mary Ann Taylor/ July 15th 1838/ Hanbury Worcestershire

Presented by his Sister/ Ann Knott / to William Taylor / as a token of love / and true friendship / Feb 24th 1852/ Good by and / God bless you for / ever / 94 Sherlock St / Pershore Road / Birmingham


My findings so far:

I checked the 1851 census years ago. My notes from then: "House called Peel Cottage between 108 and 90 Sherlock St. Many houses uninhabited including probably 94".

A poster at the Birmingham History Forum shared this info: The building at 94, seems to have been a shop. The 1855 Post Office directory has Mrs Jane Taylor, greengrocer. The 1855 Whites directory has William Taylor, shopkeeper. The Slaters 1852 directory also lists William as shopkeeper. The 1858 directory lists Charles Horton, shopkeeper. However the Post Office directory for 1849 does not list no 94 and there are no Taylors in Sherlock St.

In the 1851 census, 108 Sherlock is occupied by William Taylor, his wife Harriet J. and a new unnamed infant son. Occupation of William is Porter (then something difficult to read). William's birthplace is Droitwich.

An Ann Taylor married William Mayne Knott in Aston juxta Birmingham, 1842.

In the 1851 census, William M Knott with wife Ann is farming in Stoke Prior on Sharpway Gate. William Gardner, an uncle is also in the household. Charlotte Elizabeth Knott is a child in the household. An earlier christening in Stoke Prior states that her father is William Mayne Knott. Ann's birthplace is Droitwich.

In the 1841 census, Ann Taylor is living in the household of William Gardner, Sharpway Gate, Stoke Prior.

Today there is a property along Hanbury Rd towards Stokes Prior named "Knotts Farm". Appears to be occupied by a man named John Birch in the 1870s.

Can't find any sign of William Mayne Knott after 1851. Can't identify more about the Taylors until the census 1881, when William Taylor, age 30, is living at 4 Court Gooch St, around the corner from Sherlock St. This is my earliest definite identification of my family, tied down with a 1882 birth certificate of my gr-gr-grandfather.

Given this evidence, how confident would you be to say that the Ann Knott at Stoke Prior is the brother of William Taylor, 108 Sherlock St. Birmingham, children of a Taylor family likely from somewhere in the Droitwich-Hanbury-Stoke Prior area? That they're the William and Mary Ann Taylor from the book inscription?

Where could I look further to either prove or disprove the possibility?

I believe that I looked at the Hanbury parish microfilm years ago, but didn't find any leads. The connections to Droitwich and Stoke Prior are new discoveries.

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Offline trish1120

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Re: What conclusions can be made from this mid-1800s book inscription?
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 08 November 17 07:50 GMT (UK) »
Welcome to Rootschat.

A image of Anns 1842 Marriage is on Anc.
Her Father JOSEPH Taylor, Occp Servant.
A William Taylor is a Witness.

1851 Ann Knott is born c 1820 Droitwich.
F/S has a christening;
ANN Taylor 19 July 1820, St Andrew, Droitwich to JOSEPH/SARAH

Other possible Children including;
WILLIAM Taylor 14 June 1819 Droitwich to Joseph/Sarah, + JOSEPH christened same day.

Trish :)
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Offline trish1120

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Re: What conclusions can be made from this mid-1800s book inscription?
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 08 November 17 11:19 GMT (UK) »
William GARDNER married Sarah TAYLOR, 28 June 1812, Saint Clement, Worcester, Worcestershire.

Fits with 1841 Census
William Gardner   50
Sarah Gardner   45
Ann Taylor 20

1851 Census William Taylors Occp is Porter (jobbing)

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Offline Tim Shortt

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Re: What conclusions can be made from this mid-1800s book inscription?
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 08 November 17 14:48 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for your help.

I too found the marriage of William Gardner and Sarah Taylor. Didn't want to further clutter my post at the top. But glad to see that someone else considered that a possible connection.

The poster at Birmingham History Forum also read that as Porter Jobber. I don't know what Jobber might mean in that context. How might that relate to a shopkeeper/greengrocer?

The connections look good to me, mostly because they lead from Birmingham back to Hanbury/Stoke Prior/Droitwich, which on the map seems to be a fairly small area, a triangle of about 5 km along each side surrounding Hanbury Hall. Wonder if the fact that at christening it is Ann Taylor not Mary Ann Taylor indicates I could have the wrong Ann Taylor. It all falls apart if I should be looking for another Ann Taylor who married a man named Knott.

I'll need to go to the library and check out Ancestry. I'm guessing that if there's an image of the registration there I'll find someone else who has been researching this family.

Offline mazi

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Re: What conclusions can be made from this mid-1800s book inscription?
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 08 November 17 16:48 GMT (UK) »
Is it just a coincidence that Anne Taylor, christened 19 July, maybe born on 15 July,and the book inscription to Mary Ann is dated 15 July, possibly a birthday gift.

My interpretation of the second inscription is that Anne Knott was either at deaths door or much more likely that she was emigrating to join her husband who left earlier and was to be joined by his wife, a not uncommon practice,  but I guess you had realised this anyway

Mike


Added, I notice she was not at home in the 1841, I wonder if she left home in 1838,
hence the gift.

Sorry this is all speculation

Offline philipsearching

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Re: What conclusions can be made from this mid-1800s book inscription?
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 08 November 17 17:07 GMT (UK) »
The poster at Birmingham History Forum also read that as Porter Jobber. I don't know what Jobber might mean in that context. How might that relate to a shopkeeper/greengrocer?

A Jobber is a person paid for a particular piece of work, not employed full-time by a person or business.  He would go round looking for any jobs available (an hour, a day or whatever).

Hope this helps
Philip
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Offline Rena

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Re: What conclusions can be made from this mid-1800s book inscription?
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 08 November 17 18:59 GMT (UK) »
Is it just a coincidence that Anne Taylor, christened 19 July, maybe born on 15 July,and the book inscription to Mary Ann is dated 15 July, possibly a birthday gift.

My interpretation of the second inscription is that Anne Knott wasmuch more likely that she was emigrating to join her husband who left earlier and was to be joined by his wife, a not uncommon practice,  but I guess you had realised this anyway

Mike


I think it's a remembrance gift too, especially when you realise that wives were chattels and didn't really have their own possessions - excepting a book that her father had given her.
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Offline Tim Shortt

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Re: What conclusions can be made from this mid-1800s book inscription?
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 08 November 17 21:08 GMT (UK) »
I also read the second inscription as hinting that someone is going far away, most likely the Knotts, since my branch appears to have remained in that area of Birmingham for near 60 more years. I was hopeful that the William Mayne name was distinctive, and I'd find it again in the US or Canada or Australia. I guess there were other places in the Empire where a family might go, places where we'd have less easy access to the records.

If the father Joseph was a servant, would "Hanbury, Worcestershire" be more likely at that time to refer to the village, or the estate? Can't find any evidence of Joseph Taylor the servant in that area in 1841. There is a Joseph Taylor deceased in Droitwich 1839, but I thought a deceased father was usually noted as such on marriage records.

Offline mazi

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Re: What conclusions can be made from this mid-1800s book inscription?
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 08 November 17 21:54 GMT (UK) »
Many threads on rootschat suggest you cannot assume that deceased always appears on a marriage certificate if a father is no longer living.

Just out of curiosity is the book a bible.

Mike