Author Topic: HELP required with Latin Will on Vellum c.1560  (Read 479 times)

Offline JSHD2011

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HELP required with Latin Will on Vellum c.1560
« on: Wednesday 29 November 17 08:37 GMT (UK) »
We requested a copy of a Will relating to a potential early ancestor from the National Archive.   Now we have it, we cannot read it.  Please advise.    New to this forum, can i attached a high res image to these posts?

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Offline Bookbox

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Re: HELP required with Latin Will on Vellum c.1560
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 29 November 17 18:43 GMT (UK) »
Welcome to RootsChat  :) 

The images are legible enough as posted.

I would just point out that it’s not a will, but an Inquisition Post Mortem. This was an assessment of the land-holdings of a recently deceased tenant-in-chief of the Crown, to determine the nature and extent of his land, how it was held, and the name and age of the lawful heir. It should also include the date of death, which I think is probably 1590 (not 1560).

I can probably do it for you, though maybe not tonight. Some of the wording is standard, so it would be helpful to know if you need a full Latin transcription and a full English translation, or whether a summary in English of the main points would be sufficient.

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Offline JSHD2011

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Re: HELP required with Latin Will on Vellum c.1560
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 29 November 17 19:37 GMT (UK) »
Pass; your heart is true kind gentle person:   A summary would be fine.   It's William Hildesley (many different spellings Ilsley/Illsley/Yildesley etc) we are interested in as a potential ancestor.   We think we can make out the word Brympton (now Brimpton near Greenham and Aldermaston formerly host to a knights Hospitaller Chapel and estate).  If it is Brimpton then it is most likely don't know?! However, more likely is that it is Hall Place Farm, Beenham Berks, UK.
We would be most interested to know who his heirs were and if Brimpton is mentioned is it about one of his heirs in Brimpton?   

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Re: HELP required with Latin Will on Vellum c.1560
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 29 November 17 20:32 GMT (UK) »
I just did it quickly, while you were replying. Main points in bold.

No sign of Brimpton here, it's Beenham (written Beneham).

Some information for Beenham on this link below, which actually references this document (see footnote 4)
http://www.british-history.ac.uk/vch/berks/vol3/pp277-279

=====
Indented Inquisition taken at Reading in the aforesaid county of Berkshire on the eighth day of November in the thirty-third year of the reign of Lady Elizabeth [= 8 November 1590], by the grace of God Queen of England, France and Ireland, Defender of the Faith etc., before Francis Winchecombe, Esquire, Escheator of the said Lady Queen for the aforesaid county, by virtue of a writ of diem clausit extremum [literally, ‘he closed his last day’] of the said Lady Queen directed to the Escheator and annexed to this inquisition, to enquire following the death of William Hildeslie, gentleman, deceased, on the oaths of [names of the jurors]; they say upon their oath that the aforesaid William Hildeslie named in the said writ on the day of his death was seised in his demesne, as of fee, of and in a capital dwelling, messuage or farm called Le Haule place in Beenham, with appurtenances, in the county aforesaid; and of and in one hundred and sixty acres of land, twenty acres of meadow, forty acres of pastures and forty acres of woods, with appurtenances, in Beenham, Padworth and Woolhampton in the aforesaid county; the said messuage, formerly in the tenure or occupation of the said William Hildeslye or his assigns, was acquired by John Hildeslye, father of the said William, from William Hildeslie, Esquire, deceased. And the aforesaid William Hildeslye, then being seised of all and singular the premises as stated above in such his estate, on the eighth day of October last past [= 8 October 1590] died so seised; and that the aforesaid capital messuage and other premises with appurtenances in Beenham and Woolhampton aforesaid are held, and at the time of the death of the aforesaid William were held, from the most noble Henry, Lord Norris, and Lady Margery his wife, as of their manor of Beenham, in free socage, for the annual rent of fourteen shillings for all services; and that the aforesaid lands, meadows and pastures in Padworth aforesaid are held of lords of the manor of Padworth aforesaid, as of their manor of Padworth, in free socage, for the annual rent of twenty pence for all services; and that the aforesaid capital messuage and all other premises are worth six pounds per year, in all issues, over and above reprises; and that William Hildeslye is the son and next heir of the aforesaid William Hildeslie named in the aforesaid writ, and he is aged twenty-three years and over at the time of the taking of this inquisition; and that the aforesaid William Hildeslye the father had or held no more or other messuages, lands or tenements from the said Lady Queen, nor any other in the said county of Berkshire on the said day when he died, as far as they (the jurors) have been notified. In witness whereof to these presents both the aforesaid Escheator and the aforesaid jurors have alternately fixed their seals, on the day and year and in the place stated above.


Offline JSHD2011

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Re: HELP required with Latin Will on Vellum c.1560
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 29 November 17 20:51 GMT (UK) »
We are most grateful to your good self.

This is interesting.   There were three brothers Edward, John and George.   George the youngest is of Brimpton and may be an Ancestor.   This is definitely William son of John.  Didn't know he had a son William born 1567?

Its outlined here but I think the dates are not clear at all.
http://www.berkshirehistory.com/gentry/ilsley.html

I got the reference for the post mortem document from the web page you posted the url for:  They have changed all the references at the Nat. Arch's now so you have to ring up a speak to the right person to get the current equivalent. 
I can now get a better fix on dates of likely or more specifically unlikely concurrence with our current GEDCOM which has a William Ilsley born 1545 who married a Joanne Piper abt 1570 in Compton, Berkshire.   We think they link to George Hildesley of Brimpton but we're not sure so looking for documents to disprove rather than prove.  George is in Visitations but the dates don't seem to line up very well with the above Ilsley RBH website and now the Vellum post mortem.
https://archive.org/stream/fourvisitationso5657ryla#page/n61/mode/2up/search/hildesley

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Re: HELP required with Latin Will on Vellum c.1560
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 29 November 17 21:41 GMT (UK) »
George is in Visitations but the dates don't seem to line up very well with the above Ilsley RBH website and now the Vellum post mortem.
https://archive.org/stream/fourvisitationso5657ryla#page/n61/mode/2up/search/hildesley
Visitations are best treated with caution. Have you looked for wills, perhaps in the online catalogues of county record offices? The wills that were proved in the PCC and are at the National Archives represent a relatively small proportion of the total. Far more wills went to local probate courts. There were several probate jurisdictions for Berkshire, and consequently some Berkshire wills are probably held in other county record offices (e.g. Wiltshire, Oxfordshire).

You might want to post on the Berkshire board, where people may have better local knowledge? This present board is chiefly for deciphering handwriting etc.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/berkshire/

ADDED - just looking again at the original image, it's probably Le Haule place (now corrected above).

Offline JSHD2011

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Re: HELP required with Latin Will on Vellum c.1560
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 29 November 17 21:55 GMT (UK) »
Oh thank you so very much for all your wonderful help.   I will try the Berkshire forum now.   There seem to be Ilsleys on there so great to know!

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Re: HELP required with Latin Will on Vellum c.1560
« Reply #7 on: Friday 15 December 17 16:29 GMT (UK) »
Could do with some more help if possible.  With two Wills George Ilsley of Brimpton d.1567 (third page in Latin), and John Illesley of Aldermaston d.1590.  Not such good quality as the last.


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Re: HELP required with Latin Will on Vellum c.1560
« Reply #8 on: Friday 15 December 17 17:20 GMT (UK) »
You could try posting images of the parts you can't read, and someone may be able to help.