Author Topic: Pierce Family (of Pierce Ironworks Foundry)  (Read 1058 times)

Offline heywood

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Re: Pierce Family (of Pierce Ironworks Foundry)
« Reply #18 on: Tuesday 02 January 18 09:57 GMT (UK) »
I had another look for you Brian.

You can search here https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0610 I think you have already done that but this is the information found.

Marriage
October 1842 James Pierce and Mary Ann Murphy

Baptisms with those parents

Joanna Pierce. 27th October 1844   

Philip Pierce 15th April 1846   

Mary Pierce 6th April 1848

Alice Pierce 26th January 1852   

Anne Pierce 3rd April 1855

Anne Pierce 16th September 1856   

Martin 6th March 1858

James Pierce 24th December 1859   

Alice Pierce 25th April 1862   

John Pierce 6th June 1864   

Looking at dates, there is a possibility that there could be a birth between marriage and Joannaís birth but I canít see a baptism, can you?

Hallmark found an Elizabeth but she had a Furlong mother and there are other baptisms to James Pierce and Elizabeth Furlong so it is unlikely that it is the same James Pierce.

Elizabeth Hughes shows Wexford as her place of birth in 1911 but this may be county rather than parish.

Presumably, as it is a family story, there must have been knowledge though of the Pierce business  :-\
Was the information handed down?

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Offline RChatUser1

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Re: Pierce Family (of Pierce Ironworks Foundry)
« Reply #19 on: Tuesday 02 January 18 15:35 GMT (UK) »
To Heywood - many thanks for that latest post about the Pierces.
The birth/baptism dates for Martin, Phillip and John are similar to those that are at
http://www.buildingsofireland.ie/niah/highlights.jsp?county=WX&list=true
so I do think it is the correct family for the Pierce Ironworks.

No, I cannot find a baptism of Elizabeth with father James, but it may be in another patish becasue the 1911 Census does give her place of birth as Co.Wexford.
I wonder if, as you say, Elizabeth was born in another part of Wexford soon after the marriage, before Joanne.
Does the marriage record that you found have any location attached to it ?

I do have another family member, aged 75, who I am trying to contact - hopefully I'll have some success there.

I'll look further into those additional family members that you found in the parish registers.
Thanks again,
Brian.

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Offline heywood

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Re: Pierce Family (of Pierce Ironworks Foundry)
« Reply #20 on: Tuesday 02 January 18 16:19 GMT (UK) »
No place given re the marriage but it is the same parish.

Online sources, if I recall, state that the company was founded in 1838 so presumably the family were in the same place.

I am inclined to think that Elizabeth was not of this family but you have to keep an open mind.
There is the matter of their wealth and status; no obvious marriage yet and the two surnames in the birth references which are puzzling.
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Offline RChatUser1

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Re: Pierce Family (of Pierce Ironworks Foundry)
« Reply #21 on: Tuesday 02 January 18 16:32 GMT (UK) »
To Heywood - thanks for that.
I agree - it is looking increasingly unlikely that Elizabeth was of this family.
I'll see if I get find out more about the Pierce connection at this end.
Regards,
Brian.

Offline Wexflyer

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Re: Pierce Family (of Pierce Ironworks Foundry)
« Reply #22 on: Sunday 11 February 18 10:37 GMT (UK) »
Three comments and a question.
1. I am pretty sure that you are all trying to reinvent the wheel here, in that I believe that there are several published accounts of this family.
2. I think you are probably misinterpreting a claim to be related to this family. You seem to think it means directly descended from James of 1813. I think it means simply related - and in those days that could mean 1st or second cousin. For what it is worth, the Pierces in my line were also claimed to be related.
3. You should remember that the family were originally from Kilmore, not Wexford town.

4. A question: what does Elizabeth's marriage cert say - it should have father's name and occupation, and would be my starting place. If you don't have it, then I would concentrate on finding it. Some of the other searches/work does not make much sense without it (could be large waste of time!).
BRENNANx2 Davidstown/Taghmon,Ballybrennan; COOPER St.Helens; CREAN Raheennaskeagh/Ballywalter; COSGRAVE Castlebridge; CULLEN Lady's Island; CULLETON Forth Commons;CURRAN Hillbrook; DOYLE Clonee/Tombrack; FOX Knockbrandon; FURLONG Moortown; HAYESx2 Walsheslough/Wexford; McGILL Litter; MORRIS Forth Commons; PIERCE Lady's Island; POTTS Bennettstown; REDMOND Ballygarrett; ROCHEx2 Wexford; ROCHFORD Ballysampson/Ballyhit; SHERIDAN Monadurtlow; SINNOTT Wexford; SMYTH Gerry/Oulart; WALSH Kilrane/Wexford

Offline RChatUser1

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Re: Pierce Family (of Pierce Ironworks Foundry)
« Reply #23 on: Sunday 11 February 18 11:40 GMT (UK) »
Thanks, Wexflyer, for your interest in this issue, and for your observations.
One of my original intentions was to find some published account of the Pierce family that might mention an Elizabeth Pierce, but I have had no luck so far.
I am trying to get hold of the marriage certificate of Elizabeth to George Evans Hughes, or indeed any record of the marriage.
A relative that I have contacted claims to have had that marriage certificate (they said that the marriage took place in Shropshire) and passed it onto another family member some years ago, and I've recently emailed descendants in France who might know its whereabouts.




Offline heywood

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Re: Pierce Family (of Pierce Ironworks Foundry)
« Reply #24 on: Sunday 11 February 18 13:17 GMT (UK) »
Three comments and a question.
1. I am pretty sure that you are all trying to reinvent the wheel here, in that I believe that there are several published accounts of this family.
2. I think you are probably misinterpreting a claim to be related to this family. You seem to think it means directly descended from James of 1813. I think it means simply related - and in those days that could mean 1st or second cousin. For what it is worth, the Pierces in my line were also claimed to be related.
3. You should remember that the family were originally from Kilmore, not Wexford town.

4. A question: what does Elizabeth's marriage cert say - it should have father's name and occupation, and would be my starting place. If you don't have it, then I would concentrate on finding it. Some of the other searches/work does not make much sense without it (could be large waste of time!).

1)Yes indeed there are published accounts and very interesting as I remarked. In this case, I wasnít trying to reinvent anything just help the OP in finding records which may prove/disprove family claims.
2) I agree with you, Wexflyer,  that family claims are not always what they seem and may not be a direct line. Hence the searches to aid Brian. I have mentioned that I do not think Elizabeth is of that family.
Hallmark suggested the cousin relationship in reply #9 and perhaps the only way to find out is through registers rather than published accounts which donít give so much detail.
3)James Pierce seems to have moved from Kilmore to Wexford to establish his family and his company. That is in one account online but perhaps Wexflyer may have other information about the Kilmore Pierces.
4) As you will have read, Wexflyer, the marriage cannot yet be found despite concentrated efforts from Rootschatters.

We are now waiting to see if Brianís relative has some information.

Regards
Heywood
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Offline Wexflyer

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Re: Pierce Family (of Pierce Ironworks Foundry)
« Reply #25 on: Sunday 11 February 18 22:28 GMT (UK) »
Details on the noted architect Richard Pierce, brother of James. He built the "twin churches" in Wexford, and several more besides. Agent for Pugin in Ireland.

http://www.dia.ie/architects/view/4357/PIERCE-RICHARD%5B1%5D
BRENNANx2 Davidstown/Taghmon,Ballybrennan; COOPER St.Helens; CREAN Raheennaskeagh/Ballywalter; COSGRAVE Castlebridge; CULLEN Lady's Island; CULLETON Forth Commons;CURRAN Hillbrook; DOYLE Clonee/Tombrack; FOX Knockbrandon; FURLONG Moortown; HAYESx2 Walsheslough/Wexford; McGILL Litter; MORRIS Forth Commons; PIERCE Lady's Island; POTTS Bennettstown; REDMOND Ballygarrett; ROCHEx2 Wexford; ROCHFORD Ballysampson/Ballyhit; SHERIDAN Monadurtlow; SINNOTT Wexford; SMYTH Gerry/Oulart; WALSH Kilrane/Wexford

Offline Wexflyer

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Re: Pierce Family (of Pierce Ironworks Foundry)
« Reply #26 on: Monday 12 February 18 06:36 GMT (UK) »

1)Yes indeed there are published accounts and very interesting as I remarked. In this case, I wasnít trying to reinvent anything just help the OP in finding records which may prove/disprove family claims.

Everyone on here is invariably trying to be helpful. This query, though, has led to a lot of confusion, so my own personal attitude would be that I would not have spent the effort (and it does take effort, I know), to make that list of children of James Pierce, until things became more clear. In particular, I think the OP would be well advised to trace his own family back without reference to the foundry family, while simultaneously researching what has been published on that family. The risk here is clearly that of a forced connection.

2) I agree with you, Wexflyer,  that family claims are not always what they seem and may not be a direct line. Hence the searches to aid Brian. I have mentioned that I do not think Elizabeth is of that family.
Hallmark suggested the cousin relationship in reply #9 and perhaps the only way to find out is through registers rather than published accounts which donít give so much detail.

I agree with both of you - I was just stating my own thoughts. It is a point that bears reinforcing though.  The OP would already know if he were really a direct descendant of the foundry family! They lived in mansions, were rich etc. [ I think their principal house, Park House, was for sale last year?]. On the other hand, these family traditions almost always have some basis in fact, so the conclusion would be that they are probably distant relatives.

3)James Pierce seems to have moved from Kilmore to Wexford to establish his family and his company. That is in one account online but perhaps Wexflyer may have other information about the Kilmore Pierces.
That the family was from Kilmore was always the family tradition, and I would not doubt it. James was a blacksmith who moved to the town. I don't know of any documentation for the family in Kilmore - there are significant gaps in the Kilmore parish registers.

4) As you will have read, Wexflyer, the marriage cannot yet be found despite concentrated efforts from Rootschatters.
I understand. But IMHO finding the marriage is the essential key to progress. Without the marriage info lots of potential fits become just conjecture - witness the confusion in this thread. I would not waste too much time on other aspects if I were the OP, but focus on this.

Hope that is not too preachy, but I think we have all seen a lot of wasted effort over the years, and I  personally like to be efficient!
BRENNANx2 Davidstown/Taghmon,Ballybrennan; COOPER St.Helens; CREAN Raheennaskeagh/Ballywalter; COSGRAVE Castlebridge; CULLEN Lady's Island; CULLETON Forth Commons;CURRAN Hillbrook; DOYLE Clonee/Tombrack; FOX Knockbrandon; FURLONG Moortown; HAYESx2 Walsheslough/Wexford; McGILL Litter; MORRIS Forth Commons; PIERCE Lady's Island; POTTS Bennettstown; REDMOND Ballygarrett; ROCHEx2 Wexford; ROCHFORD Ballysampson/Ballyhit; SHERIDAN Monadurtlow; SINNOTT Wexford; SMYTH Gerry/Oulart; WALSH Kilrane/Wexford