Author Topic: SUMMERBELL confusion in Elsdon  (Read 1139 times)

Offline hilarykellis

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SUMMERBELL confusion in Elsdon
« on: Sunday 14 January 18 20:22 GMT (UK) »
Hi all,

About a year ago I asked and received help in identifying where my ancestor Isabella Summerbell was born - see link: http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=755355.0. We determined Hole, Bellingham was most likely.

Now I am trying to identify her parents, and running into some confusion. I luckily had the chance a few months ago to get to a family history centre and view the parish registers for Elsdon, because the ones transcribed in book form online are incomplete.

Here's what Isabella's marriage record says: "Christopher Arkle of Billsmoorfoot and Isabella Summerbell of Elsdon in the Parish of Elsdon were married in this Church by License this 7th day of April" - witnesses were John and James Summerbell, and Euphins Brown. Both the bride/groom signed the register.

When I was looking at the page I noticed that John Summerbell was next to her on the register marrying Mary Brown, and the fact that John Summerbell and Euphins Brown were witness to Isabella's wedding implied to me that all of these people were connected.

On Ancestry trees I find that John Summerbell was baptised abt 1773 in Bellingham, Northumberland which fits with the idea that Hole - the place Isabella names as her birth location - exists in Bellingham. So I thought these two could be siblings - but James doesn't appear on the trees with John and furthermore the parents are given as James Summerbell b. 1734 and Elizabeth Linsdale b 1724. There's no way Elizabeth could've given birth in 1779 in her fifties. They show James and Elizabeth marrying in 1760 in Cholerton. Oldest son Nicholas b. 1760 in Chollerton.

So now I am stuck on what is wrong/right. Either they have Elizabeth's birth year wrong (because honestly, to give birth in 1773 aged 49 also seems highly improbable) or something else is wrong.

Any advice? It is so hard finding Northumberland data online and very hard for me to get back to the nearest research library (I'm in the States). And it looks like maybe Isabella's baptism was never registered or is missing.

Thank you!!

Hilary

Offline maddys52

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Re: SUMMERBELL confusion in Elsdon
« Reply #1 on: Monday 15 January 18 00:41 GMT (UK) »
I haven't read through your original thread yet, but are you sure the Elizabeth married to James was born in 1724? If they are the couple who lived in Hott Hill and buried St Cuthbert, Bellingham - James 17 Oct 1797 and Elizabeth (wife of James, weaver, widow) 15 June 1800, her age 68 - so born c 1732 which would be more likely.

Offline maddys52

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Re: SUMMERBELL confusion in Elsdon
« Reply #2 on: Monday 15 January 18 00:48 GMT (UK) »
Just read your previous thread - just to note that also there is a burial on 9 Sept 1766 at St Cuthbert's Bellingham of an Elizabeth SUMMERBELL who's residence was noted as Hole.

Offline maddys52

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Re: SUMMERBELL confusion in Elsdon
« Reply #3 on: Monday 15 January 18 00:58 GMT (UK) »


On Ancestry trees I find that John Summerbell was baptised abt 1773 in Bellingham, Northumberland

John SUMMERBELL was baptised 3 Oct 1773 at St Mungo Simonburn, son of James SUMMERBELL of Hole.


Offline hilarykellis

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Re: SUMMERBELL confusion in Elsdon
« Reply #4 on: Monday 15 January 18 01:14 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for all this info. That would still put Elizabeth at a pretty high 47 years old for Isabel's birth, but seems more possible than 53 or whatever it was. Also, since I don't have Isabel's baptism, if she were born even in 1778 or 1777 rather than the 1779 in the census, that would make this parentage all the more likely.

So I am leaning toward the online trees just being wrong about Elizabeth's baptism year/parents. They had her born in 1724 in Easington, Durham.

The online trees are also saying James's parents were Nicholas and Sarah, and that he was baptised in Bellingham in 1734. Can I ask where you are accessing Bellingham registers?

Offline maddys52

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Re: SUMMERBELL confusion in Elsdon
« Reply #5 on: Monday 15 January 18 01:26 GMT (UK) »
I've been using FreeReg and familysearch.

I notice that the baptism of Isabelle on 1 Jan 1778 at Stannington says residence Milkup (and father Jonathan SUMMERBELL). There is also a Thomas SUMMERBELL born c1785 and brother Matthew born c1773 at Milkup in the 1851 census - HO107/2413 / 8 - possibly related?

Modified to add: I don't really know the area and have much faith in Gadget's advice - so possibly this isn't your Isabelle

Offline maddys52

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Re: SUMMERBELL confusion in Elsdon
« Reply #6 on: Monday 15 January 18 01:41 GMT (UK) »

So I am leaning toward the online trees just being wrong about Elizabeth's baptism year/parents. They had her born in 1724 in Easington, Durham.


 ;D Online trees are possibly a good starting point - but ...  ;)


The online trees are also saying James's parents were Nicholas and Sarah, and that he was baptised in Bellingham in 1734.

Yes James was baptised St Cuthbert, Bellingham 15 Jan 1734/35, father Nicholas, abode: Demaine.

Other siblings - Jane 19 June 1726
Elizabeth 28 Sep 1728 (abode:Coldcoats)
 Elizabeth 26 May 1731 (abode: Snoddygate)

Offline hilarykellis

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Re: SUMMERBELL confusion in Elsdon
« Reply #7 on: Monday 15 January 18 01:49 GMT (UK) »
Thank you again, maddy, this is all very helpful. Yes, I believe I had ruled that Isabel out on account of Gadget's mention that Stannington was very far away. Also, the fact that there are Summerbells in Bellingham and a place called Hole in Bellingham seems like a major clue, don't you think? But I am still not convinced about James and Elizabeth of Hott Hill being the right pair..

Offline hilarykellis

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Re: SUMMERBELL confusion in Elsdon
« Reply #8 on: Monday 15 January 18 02:05 GMT (UK) »
I noticed in Simonburn there's also a John Summerbell baptised in 1773 son of Thomas of Hill - so now I have no clue where that one fits in..