Author Topic: Ellen Gooch  (Read 627 times)

Offline MaryanneR

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 10
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Ellen Gooch
« Reply #9 on: Tuesday 16 January 18 08:12 GMT (UK) »

You need more information than you are using here. Does the marriage certificate describe Ellen as a widow.....who are the witnesses (why is she in NZ)?

What children are named on her death certificate........how many years in NZ......how many years in Australia...any mention of a previous marriage.....etc.

What BDM certificates do you have?

This for Washington Irving, arr Dec 1852
GOOCH Thomas  52
GOOCH Charlotte  50
GOOCH Ellen 23
GOOCH Henry L 14
GOOCH Edward 10
GOOCH  Thomas  1

If Thomas is a baby he could possibly be a child born to Charlotte....or is he a child born to Ellen?

So far I am seeing her as Ellen....where do you see her as Helen?

Where is the brother / sister of Ellen, your direct ancestor, when this family is in Victoria. Is your ancestor also in Victoria?

Yes, this is all the family that came to Australia.  I know all that.  The baby is Thomas and Charlotte's and also passed away on the boat.

Ellen was also know as Helen in our family.

What I  to know - does anybody on this site have any information about "James Browne" Tasmania or Melbourne, when he married Ellen Gooch and what happened to James and their daughter Anna Edith before 1860.

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline wivenhoe

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,196
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Ellen Gooch
« Reply #10 on: Tuesday 16 January 18 08:26 GMT (UK) »
You need to do your research in steps. James BROWNE, Tasmania, is a really ordinary name, and no marriage to see, and he does not register the birth, and no age for him etc.....

If Ellen marries as a spinster, she would not have  children with her, identified as son / daughter ........no Anna Edith. If Ellen marries as a widow you might hope she has a child / children with her.

If children on her death certificate include more than the McGILL children, that would suggest earlier children born to her.


RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline MaryanneR

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 10
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Ellen Gooch
« Reply #11 on: Friday 26 January 18 04:24 GMT (UK) »
Ok here is the information I know so far about Ellen Browne (nee Gooch).  She was often known as Helen in the family.

She came with her family from London to Port Philip in 1852 on the Washington Irving.  The family were:-

Thomas Caesar Gooch - Father
Charlotte Gooch - Mother
Ellen Annie Gooch
Henry Luff Gooch - brother
Edward Albert Gooch - brother
Thomas Gooch - baby brother

Sadly Thomas Caesar and baby Thomas died at sea.  Charlotte (the mother) died 2 days after arriving in Port Albert.

She had to look after Edward and Henry after this time.

Later Ellen became a governess for Sir Valentine Fleming and lived in Hobart, Tasmania

At some stage she met and (?) married James Browne, a mechanic.  They had a daughter called Anna Edith Browne, and another daughter who was still born, in Hobart

About 1860 Ellen moved to New Zealand to become a governess for James Smith of Tokomairiro (now known as Milton).  Not sure if James came with her as I can't find any information about this.  She became the first teacher of the primary school there in 1863.  She married Peter McGill in 1865.  On the marriage certificate it says she is a widow.Ellen Annie Gooch McGill is Ellen's daughter.

Peter and Ellen had several children:-

Helen Annie Gooch McGill
Thomas Nance McGill
Emily Jane Wyatt McGill
James McGill
Charlotte Bloomfield McGill
Justina Falkland McGill



If anyone can fill in the following gaps for me that would be great:-

Marriage of Ellen Gooch to James Browne
Death of James Browne
Any information about Anna Edith Browne

I am trying to obtain Ellen's death certificate to see if there is any further information on this regarding James Browne.  I cannot find an online record so I have contacted BDM to find the record for me.  Sometimes there is a misprint when they were converting to online records.

Look forward to any information people may have

Thanks

Maryanne



Offline majm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 18,831
  • NSW 1806 Bowman Flag Ecce signum.
    • View Profile
Re: Ellen Gooch
« Reply #12 on: Friday 26 January 18 04:49 GMT (UK) »
I notice that the NZ BDM online index has a death registration for a 19 year old lass, in 1885. Her name is indexed as Ellen Annie Gooch McGILL.

NZ BDM printouts are usually the better option when considering what to order.   I would expect it to include burial information and also for example, where born, and how long in New Zealand.

https://www.bdmhistoricalrecords.dia.govt.nz/home

JM
DO NOT COPY PASTE ANY OF MY POSTS TO ANY OTHER FORUM. I DO NOT GIVE PERMISSION FOR ANY OF MY POSTS TO BE SHARED WITH OTHER FORUMS.
 Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.    
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk         
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes

Offline MaryanneR

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 10
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Ellen Gooch
« Reply #13 on: Friday 26 January 18 04:56 GMT (UK) »
Ellen Annie Gooch McGill is Ellen's daughter.

Peter and Ellen had several children:-

Helen Annie Gooch McGill
Thomas Nance McGill
Emily Jane Wyatt McGill
James McGill
Charlotte Bloomfield McGill
Justina Falkland McGill

Online cando

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,801
    • View Profile
Re: Ellen Gooch
« Reply #14 on: Friday 26 January 18 05:02 GMT (UK) »
Have you searched here?
https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/2125029

You can purchase a certificate online however I would suggest you purchase a print out of Ellen's death registration not the certificate.

Cando
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Online cando

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,801
    • View Profile
Re: Ellen Gooch
« Reply #15 on: Friday 26 January 18 08:01 GMT (UK) »
Quote
Marriage of Ellen Gooch to James Browne
Death of James Browne
Any information about Anna Edith Browne

Pity the surname is so common...

There is no GOOCH/BROWN/E marriage in Australia.  I notice that Ellen was the informant on Anna's birth certificate.

Wonder if this is your man of interest :-\     According to my resource this James BROWNE was 39 when he committed suicide.

http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article3246402
Hobart Town Daily Mercury  1 Feb 1858
COUNTRY DISTRICTS
(From various Correspondents.)
BOTHWELL.
An Inquest was held on Wednesday last, on view of the body of a man named James Browne who had cut his throat on the previous day. The deceased had been fined £5 for harboring
a female passholder, and being unable to pay the amount he was sent to the Watch house. It was whilst there in custody he committed the fatal Act.
With a razor he severed his head almost from his body-cutting right through to the neck bone. At the inquest the jury returned a verdict of temporary insanity.
[How come the deceased with a razor about him when locked up in the watch house ? Was he not searched ? Ed. H T. M.]

Have you searched the passenger arrivals in NZ?

Cando
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline wivenhoe

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,196
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Ellen Gooch
« Reply #16 on: Friday 26 January 18 10:07 GMT (UK) »
"... I understand her Dad (Thomas Caesar Gooch) died on board and her mother (Charlotte Gooch) died two days after they arrived in Melbourne."

BDM VIC death
1853 / 21491 GORCH   Charlotte   parents UKN / UKN

What is the source of your information about the deaths on the ship....and Ellen's employment in Tasmania and New Zealand?

Nelson Evening Mail  (New Zealand) 18 May 1876 p2
GOOCH— SPITTAL —By special license, by Dr. Tilby at Motupipi, Edward Albert GOOCH, youngest son of Caesar Thomas GOOCH, of Brundish. County of Suffolk, England, to Jessie SPITTAL youngest daughter of James SPITTAL of Takaka.

BDM NZ births
1866/31417   McGill   Helen Annie Gooch   parents Ellen / Peter         
1867/31715   McGill   Thomas Nance           parents Ellen / Peter   
1868/34474   McGill   Emily Jane Wyatt   parents Ellen / Peter         
1869/35995   McGill   James                   parents Ellen / Peter   
1871/38923   McGill   Charlotte Bloomfield   parents Ellen / Peter   
1873/27496   McGill   Justina Falkland           parents Ellen / Peter   
   
NANCE, BLOOMFIELD and GOOCH are all names from Ellen's  ancestry. These names are important to Ellen. If Anna Edith was brought up by her mother you might hope to see her also use family names.....GOOCH at least, if nothing else.

Look for Anna Edith / Edith Anna with Ellen as mother, and GOOCH used as given name for her children.

Online cando

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,801
    • View Profile
Re: Ellen Gooch
« Reply #17 on: Friday 26 January 18 10:21 GMT (UK) »
wivenhoe....the OP is a GOOCH descendant so possibly has information that is not in the public arena.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=597330.msg5345394#msg5345394


Cando
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk