Author Topic: John Stevenson married Christian Ormiston January 1826, Cambuslang, lLKS, SCT  (Read 1473 times)

Offline brigidmac

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Re: John Stevenson married Christian Ormiston January 1826, Cambuslang, lLKS, SCT
« Reply #27 on: Friday 02 February 18 01:41 GMT (UK) »
Hi .I'm following this with interest as my grandmother was a Stevenson from Cambuslang and my great  grandfather Andrew Kyle was born  at " silverbanks" which i.m told was only a few houses in 1832

Our Stevenson's were mostly miners and weavers in 1800.s ...
The furthest back I go is Charles Stevenson b1784 married jean Morrison b1786
Maybe his father was Williamb1754 married to Mary

But I can't match names or dates to any you've mentioned .they all had big families

Good luck with your hunting !

Roberts,Fellman.Macdermid MCDERMID McDiarmid Gardner Jones ,Bloch,Irvine,Hallis Stevenson ,McKay

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Offline anne_p

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Re: John Stevenson married Christian Ormiston January 1826, Cambuslang, lLKS, SCT
« Reply #28 on: Friday 02 February 18 10:09 GMT (UK) »
Brigidmac,
I am also interested in the name Kyle from East Kilbride and Cambuslang but none of my family were connected to coal mining

Although I cannot connect your Kyle family to mine, was your Andrew Kyle b 1832 born to parents named David and Janet?

Is so, according to all census info, this Andrew Kyle was living at Silverbanks from 1861 onwards but, all census data states he was born in Rutherglen
He is found with  his parents and siblings in Rutherglen at 1841

Andrew (Ramsay) Kyle was lodging in Rutherglen at 1851
His brother, William was living at Silverbanks, Cambuslang at 1851 with his wife and son but, all  his siblings, except Andrew were in this household.

I think they were all children of David Kyle and Janet Robertson
Janet Robertson, relict of David Kyle is entered onto the Cambuslang Mortcloth dated 27 Apr 1850


All of the Kyle children, show Rutherglen as their place of birth.
John, William, David, Andrew, Robert, Alexander and Agness

There is one tree on Ancestry that follows David and his wife Janet Wardrop/Edmiston but, I am 100% certain this tree owner has allocated incorrect parents to David


The other thing to note : Silverbanks was not a single house.
It was a small area consisting of a number of properties.
There were 38 separate households in Silverbanks in 1851
( my gg grandfather is residing with his in laws in one of them)


Oh!
I see it now.
Andrew Kyle was married twice.
First to Agnes Glen in 1851
They had sons named David b 1852 and John B 1855
Agnes Glen died in 1855

Andrew  then married Christina Fleming in 1856
Daughter born 28 Dec 1861 from 2nd marriage was called :Janet Robertson Kyle

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Offline brigidmac

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Re: John Stevenson married Christian Ormiston January 1826, Cambuslang, lLKS, SCT
« Reply #29 on: Friday 02 February 18 18:51 GMT (UK) »
Anne p
Yes thats my Andrew Ramsay Kyle ...  There is a cousin with the same name  its easy to confuse them .

Our Andrew Kyle b 1832 was a coalminer in 187

he became a spirit merchant by 1881 after a mining  accident

His first wife Agnes GLEN was a seamstress

John and David b1852 were their sons 

Second wife  Christina

was mother of Jane or Jeanie Kyle who married my great grandfather
Malcolm MacDermid


* Wierdly my notes have  jean Kyle born in 1864 and I have 3 sources so will check

She never used a middle name in any of our records !

Several of the trees have the right children .some even have half brothers mentined

But some match with wrong parents

I.m going to have to check .

there were also some cousin marriages which confuses things further
Roberts,Fellman.Macdermid MCDERMID McDiarmid Gardner Jones ,Bloch,Irvine,Hallis Stevenson ,McKay

Offline brigidmac

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Re: John Stevenson married Christian Ormiston January 1826, Cambuslang, lLKS, SCT
« Reply #30 on: Friday 02 February 18 19:12 GMT (UK) »
 Anne p

Re Andrew R Kyle b1832-1881 spirit merchant

Children with wife Agnes were

David b 1852 named after paternal grandfather   David

John b 1855 after maternal grandfather John GLEN

Children With Christine FLEMING

James Kyle 1859
Janet Robertson Kyle b1860      ...*earlier child deceased ?

Robertson name comes from Christine's mother

Jeanie Kyle 1864-1920 my ggmother had 10 children was she named after agneses mother ??

Agnes  Brown Kyle 1868 I think it was respectful to name a child after first wife and the Brown name occurs in a previous generation

Christina Kyle 1871 mothers name for 3rd daughter

Isabelle Kyle 1872. ??

Mary Kyle 1876 ?

Andrew Kyle 1876 for his father .

Maybe you could pm me so we could work out the connection s rather than hijacking this post

My trees on ancestry are open

I've actually been linked by DNA to my great aunt Jean Kyle MacDermid.s descendants in New Zealand.

All very exciting i.m meeting up with my aunt tomorrow who was her neice



Roberts,Fellman.Macdermid MCDERMID McDiarmid Gardner Jones ,Bloch,Irvine,Hallis Stevenson ,McKay

Offline anne_p

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Re: John Stevenson married Christian Ormiston January 1826, Cambuslang, lLKS, SCT
« Reply #31 on: Friday 02 February 18 21:11 GMT (UK) »
Bridgid,
Robertson may be a name from Christina Fleming's family but Janet Robertson was Andrew's mother.

The child born in 1861 was named exactly for his mother.
Janet Robertson Kyle

The child you refer to as Jeanie Kyle:
Birth name was: Jane Kyle b 14 Jun 1863

Children born to Andrew from both marriages are on family search

Who is the cousin that Andrew is confused with?

Offline brigidmac

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Re: John Stevenson married Christian Ormiston January 1826, Cambuslang, lLKS, SCT
« Reply #32 on: Friday 02 February 18 22:59 GMT (UK) »
I didnt have andrews mothers name

Thanks for that information
 
Christina s mother was elizabeth ROBERTSON
And i seem to remember a mary BROWN maybe a great grandmother

I find ancestry harder to search on .

 scotlandspeople has changed its format since i used it last year .

its good to see the documents in original form .

So much information
I will make note of occupations of Stevensons

Out of interest what occupations did your families have ?
Stevensons &
Kyles


My Macdermids were cloth lappers and bleachfield workers for 3 generations

My grandad s generation escaped those proffessions eventually
Becoming     a shoemaker  .clerk in a garden nursery .a funeral worker .grocers clerk .

the girls were seamstresses .bleach workers a waitress and an umbrella  maker .
Grandad ran away to sea joined navy aged 17 .
Roberts,Fellman.Macdermid MCDERMID McDiarmid Gardner Jones ,Bloch,Irvine,Hallis Stevenson ,McKay

Offline Orontes

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Re: John Stevenson married Christian Ormiston January 1826, Cambuslang, lLKS, SCT
« Reply #33 on: Saturday 03 February 18 09:08 GMT (UK) »
Orontes,
Did you find this?
Marriage of Andrew Ormiston and Bethia Balfour  ( Bethia is a variant of Elizabeth)
Banns: 6 Oct 1793 Barony

Children on SP born to Andrew Ormiston and Elizabeth Balfour
Christian: 7 Jun 1807 Gorbals
Jane Douglas: 10 Oct 1813 Gorbals

From the 1851 census in Cambuslang, you already know that there was an older child named Andrew Ormiston entered as age 46.
 Born circa 1895, which is around 2 yrs after parents married

Christian & her sister were born 12yrs & 20yr respectively, after their parents marriage.
There are probably other children where the baptism entries have not survived

However, it seems odd that John & Christina Stevenson do not appear to have a child named for Christina's mother
Looking at the Stevenson births between 1826 and 1835, there isn't an obvious gap where a daughter with this name would fit in?
Hi Anne,
I have been to Family History Society today and our Librarian help me search for our Stevenson's family.  You have opened a can of worms.

It looks very likely that Christina Campbell born c1850 was in fact our  Isabella Stevenson's illegitimate child. Though it has posed another question.

Just to recap.

In  1841 at Cullochburn, Cambuslang
John Stevenson 45,
Christina Stevenson 30
George Stevenson 13
Isabella Stevenson 11

In 1851 Bushyhill, Cambuslang,
John Stevenson 58
Christina Stevenson 43
Mary 25 dau
Janet 9 dau
John 6 son
Andrew Ormiston 46 brother in law
CHRISTINA CAMPBELL 1,born Cambuslang,  Grand daughter in 1861 Christina is down as neice which of course we know can be exchanged with granddaughter.


As per your request, I have the marriage and the death of Christina Campbell.

Marr took place  8th October, Torrance, Campsie, Stirling to Robert Black, fireman in Coal Pit.  Her father was William Campbell, Farmer, Mother Isabella Campbell. Maiden Surname Stevenson.  No marriage found to this couple. Christina was 19. After Banns in Church of Scotland. witnesses Arthur Black and ? Nish.

Christina Black nee Campbell's death. 4th May 4.15 am, Crosshill, Lennoxtown, Campsie, Stirling. Father. William Campbell (Reputed) Cattle Dealer. Mother Isabella Stevenson, Domestic Servant (Now married to William McArthur (Farmer)

Here lies the problem.  Our Isabella Stevenson married John McArthur, not a William McArthur.  However, everything points to this Christina Campbell from the 1851/1861 census to this death of Christina Black nee Campbell being the daughter of Isabella Stevenson. The Librarian thinks that maybe the informant at death Christina's brother in law Gavin Black of Torrance, has given wrong name, but I would need more proof, before I would record it as fact.  The Librarian looked for all records to do with a marriage for a Isabella Stevenson to a William McArthur, anywhere in Scotland but couldn't find one, but then again, she couldn't find the marriage of a Isabella Stevenson to a John McArthur either.  I have the certificate for many years of that marriage.

Could be the reason why she didn't bring the child with her is because her father William Campbell, wouldn't allow it. It appears as if he has acknowledged himself from the birth  to death as her father. Mentioned on census, marriage and death as  M.S.Campbell.

I have never been able to find the birth or baptism of a John McArthur, born to a Duncan McArthur and a Margaret McArthur nee Smith as per his marriage certificate. Or any other child to that couple.

We have three children born to Christina and Robert Black nee Campbell so far,and she has named one  in 1870 Christina Stevenson Black, in 1870 John Black and in 1879 Christina Ormiston Black.  That seems to tie in with  the Stevenson and Ormiston family. So apart from the husband who I know to be John and he died a John McArthur not William. Everything else ties in.  Our line here is a William McArthur, I think he was named after John Stevenson's brother William, who you told me died in 1854.

John McArthur died at his farm in Patersonia, Tasmania in 13th April 1910 and Isabella McArthur nee Stevenson died Patersonia, 1st August, 1914, they were both in their 80's, so I wonder if any of the Black children ever came over.

I see I already had Robert Spiers as the husband of Mary on my chart 29 Apr 1851, but never connected himto the witness on marriage cert of John and Isabella McArthur nee Stevenson.. On my chart I had Christian death August 1846 aged 14 and Andrews death 7 march 1836.  the two younger children Janet and john, I havent listed them.
Isabella Stevenson daughter

Offline Orontes

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Re: John Stevenson married Christian Ormiston January 1826, Cambuslang, lLKS, SCT
« Reply #34 on: Saturday 03 February 18 09:22 GMT (UK) »
Anne p

Re Andrew R Kyle b1832-1881 spirit merchant

Children with wife Agnes were

David b 1852 named after paternal grandfather   David

John b 1855 after maternal grandfather John GLEN

Children With Christine FLEMING

James Kyle 1859
Janet Robertson Kyle b1860      ...*earlier child deceased ?

Robertson name comes from Christine's mother

Jeanie Kyle 1864-1920 my ggmother had 10 children was she named after agneses mother ??

Agnes  Brown Kyle 1868 I think it was respectful to name a child after first wife and the Brown name occurs in a previous generation

Christina Kyle 1871 mothers name for 3rd daughter

Isabelle Kyle 1872. ??

Mary Kyle 1876 ?

Andrew Kyle 1876 for his father .

Maybe you could pm me so we could work out the connection s rather than hijacking this post

My trees on ancestry are open

I've actually been linked by DNA to my great aunt Jean Kyle MacDermid.s descendants in New Zealand.

All very exciting i.m meeting up with my aunt tomorrow who was her neice
Hi Brigid,
The Witness at the death of our John Stevenson in Cambuslang 26th November 1871 was a William Robertson, son in law, residing at Cluny Cottages, Pitlochry, Blair Athol. He may be part of your Robertson family. The only living female he could have been husband to was Jannet Stevenson aged 9 in 1851 census, Cambuslang.

Offline anne_p

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Re: John Stevenson married Christian Ormiston January 1826, Cambuslang, lLKS, SCT
« Reply #35 on: Saturday 03 February 18 13:15 GMT (UK) »
Orontes,
I guss that the facts speak for themselves.
Christina Campbell was the daugter of Isabella Stevenson and Grand daughter of Christina Stevenson Ms Ormiston.


Christina Campbell married and had 2 daughters.
One named for her mother: Isabella Stevenson and the other named for her grandmother: Christina Ormiston.

When Christina Black MS Campbell died, her brother in law knew that Christina's mother had the maiden name of Isabella Stevenson and that she was now Mrs McArthur.
He simply thought the Mcarthur husband was called  William rather than John

The other way to look at this is:
John Stevenson and Christina Ormiston had just one daughter named Isabella who married John McArthur.
You know that Christina Campbell was Isabella's own child who was born before this marriage
You also know that Christina Campbell was the gran daughter of Christina Stevenson Ms Ormiston
From her marriage and death, Christina Campbell is positively identified as Isabella's daughter

John Stevenson and Christina Ormiston did not have another daughter named Isabella who was also married to William McArthur

The child named Christina Ormiston Black died the same year that she was born.
At 1881, both of the other children, Isabella and John Black were living with their paternal grandparents.

In know that their father, Robert Black remarried and the child named Isabella Black also married later.
I am not sure where John went.
However, I will look again, and find the information on Isabella Black, her marriage and children.
I didn't retain the info that I found but, I do recall that I could not find her or her family at 1901.