Author Topic: Funeral Home dilemma - Thomas BRUGMAN, Dargaville.  (Read 1280 times)

Offline TreeSpirit

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Re: Funeral Home dilemma - Thomas BRUGMAN, Dargaville.
« Reply #36 on: Thursday 08 February 18 06:10 GMT (UK) »

By 1897 Thomas’ grandparents have 7 living children (incl Thomas' father) and there could have been more:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-99Q3-23JC?i=466&wc=955S-BZZ%3A338129501%2C342375201%2C338276701%3Fcc%3D2018408&cc=2018408

Clearly finding ancestors and distant rellies is not the problem … the issue is finding living family that is not too distant, who know who he is and who are willing to make important decisions (including the possibility of having to pay for the cremation/burial)

Sylvia


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Offline TwiggyTree

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Re: Funeral Home dilemma - Thomas BRUGMAN, Dargaville.
« Reply #37 on: Thursday 08 February 18 06:54 GMT (UK) »
Great, it seems as if we are getting somewhere together; and I am learning about another country's archives at the same time.

The lovely Dutch gentleman that I am in contact with confirmed that in 1956 at least Thomas's 3 brothers and 1 sister were all still alive.  He advised that the research at his end may take a couple of weeks to find living relatives of the same.  Let's hope that Perpetual Guardian and the High Court take this into account.

Really wish we all knew what had already specifically been tried to find living relatives so we aren't relying on the good nature of fellow genies for nothing.
...out of, through, and back from New Zealand to the ends of the Earth

FRYER - MITCHELL - DUKE - WHYTE - McDONALD - TAYLOR - CARPENTER - HARRIS - WILLIAMS - CUNNINGHAME - LUCAS - WHITE - BOTHAM - HOLDAWAY - EYLES - OLSEN - CHASE - TRAILL - BAGGS - HASKINS - EDWARDS - CHING - SHIELDS - POLLARD - HOGAN - SMITH - STANLEY - HALL - ROBERTS - LARKHAM

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Offline WendyNapierWalker

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Re: Funeral Home dilemma - Thomas BRUGMAN, Dargaville.
« Reply #38 on: Friday 09 February 18 04:10 GMT (UK) »
TreeSpirit - You make a good point, however sometimes we need to go backwards to go forward.

Last year, for a woman, I located the living relatives of her deceased US Marine father who was in NZ during WW2.  To do this I had to go backwards and then work forward, achieving a successful outcome.

TwiggyTree hopefully the "lovely Dutch gentleman" is able to find living relatives - fingers crossed!

Wendy

Online Fresh Fields

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Re: Funeral Home dilemma - Thomas BRUGMAN, Dargaville.
« Reply #39 on: Friday 09 February 18 22:09 GMT (UK) »

Edited ..
Clearly finding ancestors and distant rellies is not the problem … the issue is finding living family that is not too distant, who know who he is and who are willing to make important decisions (including the possibility of having to pay for the cremation/burial)

Sylvia

Agreed. When Morris & Morris reassigned responsibility for the body to the offer by Perpetual Gaurdian it was publically stated that they would apply to the Court to become Executor of his Estate at no cost. But that was at the time of the undertaker claiming that they had made enguiries including extending to Holand, without finding kext of kin.

What I have not seen, nor had privately, is a clarification as to whether there is a cavaet to the no cost offer, if the public were to come forward with details of next of kin.

Alan.
Early Settlers & Heritage. Family History.

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Re: Funeral Home dilemma - Thomas BRUGMAN, Dargaville. COMPLETED
« Reply #40 on: Wednesday 14 February 18 00:13 GMT (UK) »
Hello all - thanks for your help.

As far as I'm concerned this forum posting is now COMPLETE.

This morning I contacted by phone, the Perpetual Guardian lawyer, that we were advised to contact, if we had information that we felt could help identify next of kin.

The gentlemam concerned was polite, and business like, as I was expecting. Respecting peoples privacy, but he did assure me that they would be greatful to recieve the family info that was recorded when the gentleman emigrated to NZ. Locating benificeries of an estate for dispersing the residue, can be quite an exercise at times.

Herald part quote :-
Thomas Brugman died in July last year but no next of kin can be found so the funeral home can't cremate the body unless it applies to the High Court to get the Public Trust to take over the process, at a cost of about $200.

Perpetual Guardian has offered to apply to the High Court to execute his estate and put him to rest at their own cost.

As the law stands, if someone dies without next of kin and without a will, someone cannot simply step in to deal with the estate or the body.".

End of quote.

As expected, the Herald reporter possibly assumed too much from the stated offer, of starting the process, of applying to the Court for executorship of the estate. The cost of that filing being approximately $200.

The lawyer did not believe that the offer was "pro bono" but that when the executor had fulfilled their duties, the costs thereof would be viewed favourably if available funds were limited.

Accordingly I forwarded by email Wendy's findings, plus a few notes about the RC forum and team who all pitched in.

I have now recieved an accknoledgment reply, that the material was recived. And a thank you for the effoerts involved.

- Alan.

Added PS.
As we can not discuss the living on line, is the reason for me wishing to complete this thread. However if anyone considers that they have late material of significance I'm happy to forward it.

Just PM me.
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Offline mish231

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Re: Funeral Home dilemma - Thomas BRUGMAN, Dargaville. COMPLETED
« Reply #41 on: Sunday 18 February 18 18:22 GMT (UK) »
Hello,

I came across this post by accident. I live in The Netherlands and I am in contact with the first cousin of Mr Thomas Brugman. Is there anything I can pass on to family here in The Netherlands?

Regards
Michelle




Hello all - thanks for your help.

As far as I'm concerned this forum posting is now COMPLETE.

This morning I contacted by phone, the Perpetual Guardian lawyer, that we were advised to contact, if we had information that we felt could help identify next of kin.

The gentlemam concerned was polite, and business like, as I was expecting. Respecting peoples privacy, but he did assure me that they would be greatful to recieve the family info that was recorded when the gentleman emigrated to NZ. Locating benificeries of an estate for dispersing the residue, can be quite an exercise at times.

Herald part quote :-
Thomas Brugman died in July last year but no next of kin can be found so the funeral home can't cremate the body unless it applies to the High Court to get the Public Trust to take over the process, at a cost of about $200.

Perpetual Guardian has offered to apply to the High Court to execute his estate and put him to rest at their own cost.

As the law stands, if someone dies without next of kin and without a will, someone cannot simply step in to deal with the estate or the body.".

End of quote.

As expected, the Herald reporter possibly assumed too much from the stated offer, of starting the process, of applying to the Court for executorship of the estate. The cost of that filing being approximately $200.

The lawyer did not believe that the offer was "pro bono" but that when the executor had fulfilled their duties, the costs thereof would be viewed favourably if available funds were limited.

Accordingly I forwarded by email Wendy's findings, plus a few notes about the RC forum and team who all pitched in.

I have now recieved an accknoledgment reply, that the material was recived. And a thank you for the effoerts involved.

- Alan.

Added PS.
As we can not discuss the living on line, is the reason for me wishing to complete this thread. However if anyone considers that they have late material of significance I'm happy to forward it.

Just PM me.

Offline TwiggyTree

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Re: Funeral Home dilemma - Thomas BRUGMAN, Dargaville.
« Reply #42 on: Sunday 18 February 18 18:52 GMT (UK) »
Hello Michelle

I will let Fresh Fields advise definitively as this is his thread.

Initially we were trying to find a living relative as apparently the funeral home could not.  Then the issue of financial liability came into the equation and I think many here wanted to have a guarantee from the interim executors that any living relative was being sought for the right reasons ie humanitarian and not financial.

Twiggy
...out of, through, and back from New Zealand to the ends of the Earth

FRYER - MITCHELL - DUKE - WHYTE - McDONALD - TAYLOR - CARPENTER - HARRIS - WILLIAMS - CUNNINGHAME - LUCAS - WHITE - BOTHAM - HOLDAWAY - EYLES - OLSEN - CHASE - TRAILL - BAGGS - HASKINS - EDWARDS - CHING - SHIELDS - POLLARD - HOGAN - SMITH - STANLEY - HALL - ROBERTS - LARKHAM

Offline mish231

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Re: Funeral Home dilemma - Thomas BRUGMAN, Dargaville.
« Reply #43 on: Sunday 18 February 18 18:59 GMT (UK) »

Thank you for your reply.  I have in any case informed his cousin of this unfortunate situation. If there is anything I can relay I would be more than willing to pass on information. I will await further replies. Thank you again.

Michelle

Hello Michelle

I will let Fresh Fields advise definitively as this is his thread.

Initially we were trying to find a living relative as apparently the funeral home could not.  Then the issue of financial liability came into the equation and I think many here wanted to have a guarantee from the interim executors that any living relative was being sought for the right reasons ie humanitarian and not financial.

Twiggy

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Re: Funeral Home dilemma - Thomas BRUGMAN, Dargaville.
« Reply #44 on: Sunday 18 February 18 19:14 GMT (UK) »
Greetings from New Zealand.

Thank you for your offer of assistance. As per PM to you, I suggest you email the lawyer at Perpetual Guardian, at the email provided in a couple of places on this thread.

Regards,

Alan.
Early Settlers & Heritage. Family History.