Author Topic: Charles Edmund Crossant Hill  (Read 378 times)

Offline roycymru

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Charles Edmund Crossant Hill
« on: Monday 12 February 18 21:04 GMT (UK) »
Hello

Been re-visting some previous research and wondering if anyone else has done research on Charles and/or has connections and can add to the below or has evidence to contradict it and/orcome up with different conclusions.

I think there must links to William Edmund and Margaret Edmund (nee Thomas) of Herberdeg farm Five roads, Llanelly, but am not clear what. William Edmund and Margaret Thomas did have a son Charles but he married a Margaret Griffith and ended up in Aberdare.

This is what I have:

Charles Edmund married Mary David   30/12/1814

Charles was born around 1795
There is no obvious connection to William Edmund from the marriage entry, However (see below)
Charles was a bachelor and Mary a spinster both from Llanelly.
Neither Charles or Mary signed fully (just put “X”).
Witnesses were Isaac Griffiths and John William

In the 1841 census there were 3 Charles Edmunds in Carmarthenshire Charles Edmund age 40 (and a Mary) a Farmer of Crossant Hill, Glyn Hamlet, Charles Edmund and Margaret, Collier of Tyrderry, Hengoed Hamlet ("known" son) and Charles Edmund also age 25 (also married to a Margaret) a Copperman, living at the Copper Works, Llanelly, so we can discount the later 2 Charles as being this one they were married to a Margarets.

Charles of Crossant was specifically mentioned as a main participant in the Rebecca papers (“Charles Edmund of Crossant”, “Charles Edmund not disguised except his coal black face”, Charles of Crossant (watched with Evan on the road)”.

Charles Edmund of Crossant Hill in 1841 was listed as age 40, living with Mary (60), Anne (20) and Margaret (15). Despite the age difference it looks like they were married, as they are both listed as parents of Ann and Margaret (both baptized 25 May 1824 at St.Eli), the abode is also given as Crossant Hill on the baptism entries (where Charles is listed as Collier rather than Farmer).  The marriage that corresponds is the above in 1814 (however if Charles was 40 in 1841 he would only been 13 if married in 1814, but as the ages in the census of 1841 were rounded he could have been as old as 44 then this would fit (as he would have been 17/18), plus in the “File of Rebecca Papers” from 1843 he is listed as even older “Chas. Edmund---Cressant aged 50”). His age is confirmed by his death certificate (13 Jan 1848) where his age is 53 and therefore born abt. 1795. His address then was Fosyrefel and the the informant was Josuah (Joshua) Thomas of Forsyrefel, Hengoed Hamlet.

As Charles was living in Glyn Hamlet at Crossant, and next to Herberdeg farm in 1841 there must be some relationship to Margaret (and William) Edmunds, whether he was a son from William’s first marriage to Jane Harvey though is unclear as he was born around 1796 the year William and Jane married. Plus he did not sign his marriage entry unlike the other known sons.

Mary Edmund married William Bowen   27 Dec 1850      

Mary is of Charles Edmund (Collier), as stated on her marriage certificate. Mary was born around 1827. This together with the fact that in 1841 she was at Herberdeg, next door to Crossant Hill, where Charles Edmund and Mary (his wife) were living indicates Mary was a daughter of Charles and Mary.

However there are strong links between Mary and Margaret Edmund. In 1841 she is living with Margaret at Herberdeg, in 1851 Mary and William Bowen are living with Margaret and William Jones at Caerbrenin (reference HO107 Piece 2468, Folio 389, Page 13), In 1861 Mary and William Bowen and family are still living at Caerbrenin (reference RG9, Piece 4114, Folio 62, Page 31) as is Margaret (Holder of Land).

In 1871 they are living at "Cwmaman" in Llandebie, Cwmamman (reference RG19, Piece, 5849, Folio 88, Page 20).

Margaret Edmund died at Llandebie, Cwmamman on 12 Jul 1866 (informant John Jones). My guess is that Margaret may have moved to Cwamman to live with or be near Mary.

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Offline despair

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Re: Charles Edmund Crossant Hill
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 13 February 18 11:29 GMT (UK) »
It seems to me that Charles of Crossant Hill is very likely to be the son of William and Margaret(married 1804)of Herberdeg,though I can't immediately see a death record for William,as he doesn't appear in 1841.The record for Charles marriage to Mary David gives Mary as a widow.Also the GRO records give a birth for a Margaret Edmund in Llanelly,1839 with mother's maiden name Griffiths as per the family at Tyrderg.
The "Copper" Charles is likely to be Charles Edmond(with an "o"),who married Margaret Bevan in 1831.The GRO records confirm mmn Bevan for their child Elizabeth.

Regards
Roger

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Offline roycymru

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Re: Charles Edmund Crossant Hill
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 13 February 18 13:35 GMT (UK) »
Hi

Thanks for this information and your feedback. The only downside to this is that Charles was born around 1795 but William and Margaret did not marry until 1804, though William did have a first wife Jane Harvey 22 Apr 1796, so if Charles actual birth is actually a bit later he could be their son.

Regards