Author Topic: Brick wall that has been there over 30 years! John Johnstone Cumming b.1786  (Read 2106 times)

Offline edgane

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Hi

Can any of you clever people help me break down a 30+ year old brick wall in my family tree?
I have extensive research into my family done over nearly 40 years but this is my bugbear!

John Johnstone Cumming had a long military career of which I have details and died as the Governor of the Military Knights at Windsor Castle in 1843. He served in the 8th West Indian Regt mainly in the West Indies and whilst there, married a baroness from the (then) British Virgin Island of St Croix. They had 4 children all born in the West Indies but came home to christen them all in Drumblade Church near Huntly. His wedding in Guadeloupe in 1811 was also recorded at Drumblade Church so he clearly had connections with that area. His first wife died in Barbados in 1821 and when he remarried in 1826 in Scotland he was living at Lessendrum House, also in Drumblade. He was also a JP for Aberdeenshire around 1828, The problem is that all the John Cumming births around 1786 in Scotland do not state the key middle name Johnstone so I cannot be sure which one is him! He wrote a pleading letter on his military record in 1828 and seems to know a lot of prestigious people so I think he came from quite a good, well heeled family.
I cannot definitely connect him to the Huntly branch of the Cumming family and could never assume  a baptism is correct without firm facts to back it up! So there is my brick wall!
I have tried maiden names of his mother possibly being Johnstone and the children's names holding clues to the parents names but I'm still stuck. I would really appreciate any help you can give me. My mum has been on this journey with me for 40 years and is now 92 so as it is her side of the family I would love to crack this while she is still with us :-) I have heaps of extra info if you want anything added please let me know.

Elaine Dering Gane

Details:-
Children's names:-
Jane Forrester Cumming born 24 Feb 1815 in St Lucia
Jannet Mary Cumming born 13 Dec 1816 in St Lucia
Andrew Leith Hay Cumming born 23 Jul 1818 in West Indies (place unknown)
Robert Aberdeen Cumming born 6 Oct 1820 in Guadeloupe

Wife No 1 Judith de Bretton daughter of Baron Frederick of St Croix, BVI
Wife No 2 Mary Ann Lane daughter of John Lane vicar of Sawbridgeworth, Herts

Christening details

1   8 Apr 1818   CUMMING   JANNET MARY           JOHN CUMMING/JUDITH   DRUMBLADE   
2   8 Apr 1818   CUMMING   JEAN FORRESTER   JOHN CUMMING/JUDITH   DRUMBLADE   3      26 Jan 1821   CUMMING   JOHN ROBT ABERDEEN   JOHN JONSTONE/CUMMING JUDITH DE BRITTON FR324 NOB BARRONESS   DRUMBLADE   (John & Judith's 10th wedding anniversary)

4   26 Jan 1821   CUMMING   ANDREW LEITH HAY   JOHN JONSTONE/CUMMING JUDITH DE BRITTON FR324 NOB BARRONESS      DRUMBLADE   (John & Judith's 10th wedding anniversary)

Offline bleckie

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Re: Brick wall that has been there over 30 years! John Johnstone Cumming b.1786
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 18 March 18 12:04 GMT (UK) »
Hi
Go to Google type Andrew Leith hay  gives wiki page for Sir Andrew Leith Hay of Rannes on same page there is a reference to William Gordon Drummond
May be coincidence or red herring but I would say worth a look

Yours Aye
BruceL

Offline edgane

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Re: Brick wall that has been there over 30 years! John Johnstone Cumming b.1786
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 18 March 18 12:41 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for your reply. I am aware of Andrew Leith Hay but assume my man's son was just named after him as I can't link him to the Cumming family directly! I will give it another go however. I am grateful for your time and thoughts.
Regards Elaine 

Offline bleckie

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Re: Brick wall that has been there over 30 years! John Johnstone Cumming b.1786
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 18 March 18 13:31 GMT (UK) »
Hi Elaine

If you go back to the previous generation there is a family in Keith where the mothers maiden name is Johnston (this would be your man's grandmother) if it is the correct family

CUMMING JAMES  JOHN CUMMING/ELIZABETH JOHNSTON M 15/07/1746 159/  20 6 Keith

CUMMING WILLIAM  JOHN CUMMING/ELIZABETH JOHNSTON M 05/02/1749 159/ 20 24 Keith

Yours Aye
BruceL


Offline DonM

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Re: Brick wall that has been there over 30 years! John Johnstone Cumming b.1786
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 18 March 18 14:44 GMT (UK) »
Unless he was the son of Alexander the shoemaker in Glasgow its the only Cumming/Johnson/Johnston/Johnstone I see within your timeline and they don't have a John or at least one showing as being baptised.

The other thing to consider is that "Johnstone" may not be related at all or a name he himself adopted.

Any idea who his siblings were?

And, just in case, but you probable have this Mary Anne's d April 1852 in Oxford at A.L. Impey's residence.  Apparently he/she were relatives.

Don
I have turned off all email notifications, thank you.

Offline edgane

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Re: Brick wall that has been there over 30 years! John Johnstone Cumming b.1786
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 18 March 18 14:48 GMT (UK) »
Hi again
That looks really interesting! Where is Keith in relation to Drumblade? My Scottish geography is rubbish, I'll Google it when I get back on the pc!
Thanks for your help. I still don't know how I can prove if that is his family or not! A family of Cummings in Huntly looks hopeful too but again how can I be sure? I prefer definites rather than assumptions hence my brick wall!
Regards Elaine

Offline edgane

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Re: Brick wall that has been there over 30 years! John Johnstone Cumming b.1786
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 18 March 18 14:54 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for your reply. No idea of siblings or parents just the Aberdeen and specifically Drumblade connection. Yes I know about Mary Ann's death and the Impey connection thank you. Glasgow shoemaker looks unlikely, you can see how I have hit the brick wall!
Thanks again
Regards Elaine

Offline HannahR

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Re: Brick wall that has been there over 30 years! John Johnstone Cumming b.1786
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 18 March 18 15:10 GMT (UK) »
Hello Elaine,

Have you had a look through the parish registers other than for just the baptisms? There may be a mention of the surname if he came from a prominent family which seems to be the case. The Old Parish Registers sometimes contain visiting lists from the Minister or other snippets. These details may help you go back even further.

Also have you looked at all the baptisms for the specific date that you are looking for? If his family was prominent the parents would be listed with occupation/title in most cases. Having a look at several of the registers may be your only option to narrow it down.

Hope this helps,
Hannah
The following names appear in my family tree: Bells [Dumfries], Todd [Perth], McLean [Campbeltown], Newson [Suffolk], Fosse(y) [Buckinghamshire], Butler [Glamorganishire], Jenkins [Glamorgan/ England], Tilling or Telling [Gloucestershire]

Offline bleckie

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Re: Brick wall that has been there over 30 years! John Johnstone Cumming b.1786
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 18 March 18 16:09 GMT (UK) »
Hi Elaine
From memory I think the distance between Drumblade and Keith is less than 20 miles.

If you have a look at the old maps at www.nls.uk it will give you a better idea
Yours Aye
BruceL