What are the odds of me being able to find what was my Great-Great-Great-Grandpa

[StevieSteve]

Woah .. do I ever have questions!
 Sorry, but I'm out of my water here...
- Stevie, when you say "Looks like what you need will be at Beverley" followed by "DDX2003/8/1-55
& DDX2003/8/12"  I'm assuming you are referring to records  at the Treasure House, Champney Road, Beverley?  The numbers are specific file or documents? 
-How in the world did you access them so quick??  You live in their basement
 

There's an online catalogue 

If you go to the East Riding Archives site, go to the catalogue and search for John Pinder Kilham you should see an entry for Farm in Kilham, deeds or similar with 55 records. You would use the DDX reference to look at the original docs at Beverley.

If one of them doesn't have a precise map, I'd be amazed.

Even then, they also seem to have the Kilham tithe map (probably created in the 1830s) which should be massive showing numbered plots of land whose owners and occupiers can then be referenced in the Tithe Apportionment file.

[StevieSteve]

So, John Pinder was never the owner of the land, just a tenant?   In 1855 it was owned by a Miss Newton and sold to a William Lamplugh? .
So John Pinder was replaced as a tenant by... William Newton?  Bit confused here.

Yes, That's what it looks like to me

[StephenCND]

Yet, he still had a Will, despite only being a tenant?

Regarding accessing the archives on line at the East Riding Archives site: It doesn't look like I can do that. You must register, but it seems it's only open to UK citizens (I'm Canadian), with valid british postal codes..  Oh the pain....

EDIT: Never mind.. I kinda cheated

[davidft]

Yet, he still had a Will, despite only being a tenant?

Regarding accessing the archives on line at the East Riding Archives site: It doesn't look like I can do that. You must register, but it seems it's only open to UK citizens (I'm Canadian), with valid british postal codes..  Oh the pain....

EDIT: Never mind.. I kinda cheated

I would email them and ask if you can register. As I see it, it does not preclude non British people its just the software they have used uses the postcode file to identify addresses. I doubt they have not encountered this before and already have an answer, but if that is not the case and you are the first then you could be a trendsetter 

[goldie61]

Yet, he still had a Will, despite only being a tenant?

[goldie61]

Yet, he still had a Will, despite only being a tenant?

Being a tenant didn't preclude him from making a will.
I have some very wealthy 'tenants' in my ancestry who left plenty of wills.
It just means he rented the land. In some parts of England, they had almost permanent leases from the local big-wig who owned the land, and even passed on these leases in their wills.
A will states who the testator wants to leave other things to, and might include provision for the wife (as an annuity), or for children under 21. Anything really that was thought of as necessary or important. (Shakespeare famously left his 'second best bed' to his wife ............. )

[StephenCND]

I believe you are correct, Goldie. Looking at the Will once agin, there is no mention of land , dimensions acreage, etc.. There is also mention of him willing a "tenement or dwellinghouse"  to his eldest son John. The word "tenement" is significant.

Regarding searching for "John Pinder(ar) Kilham" at the East Riding Archives site , I must admit it's been somewhat frustrating. I only get a limited number of his (19 to be exact). No idea to get to documents re. tithes etc......  Bit at a loss.

[StevieSteve]

Yes, there are 19 hits

Find the one titled Declaration of Matthew Lamplugh of Kilham, yeoman
Click on DDX2003/8/12 to the left of it
Click on Finding number DDX2003/8/12

should show the full list of 55 docs


   1 - Copy probate will of Peter Berriman of Kilham, yeoman
   2 - Receipt for £505 of William Newton the purchaser of Lot 18 of estates devised under the will of Sir Christopher Sykes baronet
   3 - Copy probate of the will and codicil of Peter Berriman of Kilham, gentleman
   4 - Copy receipts for legacies in the will of William Watson
   5 - Inland Revenue, Legacy receipt relating to Ann Barker
   6 - Inland Revenue, Legacy receipt relating to Mary Mason
   7 - Inland Revenue, Legacy receipt relating to Mary Craig
   8 - Agreement relating to rebuilding of farmyard wall at Kilham
   9 - Inland Revenue, Legacy receipt relating to Bessy Newton
   10 - Inland Revenue, Legacy receipt relating to Mary Newton
   11 - Inland Revenue, Legacy receipt relating to John Greenwell and Ann Greenwell, his wife
   12 - Declaration of Matthew Lamplugh of Kilham, yeoman
   13 - Declaration of Jane Newton of Wath House, Pickering Marishes, North Riding, spinster, relating to the Newton family
   14 - Declaration of Jane Newton of Wath House, Pickering Marishes, North Riding, spinster, relating to the deaths of three children of Richard Hodgson
   15 - Abstract of title of Miss Jane Newton to an estate at Kilham contracted to be sold to Mr William Lamplugh
   16 - Memorandum of agreement relating to 4 cottages and gardens in Kilham
   17 - Abstract of title of the trustees of the late Emanuel Lownsbrough to 4 cottages and premises at Kilham contracted to be sold to James Durham
   18 - Inland Revenue, Residuary account of Emanuel Lowndsborough [Lownsbrough] of Kilham, yeoman
   19 - Abstract of title of Ralph Creyke to an estate at Kilham and Rudston part of which is contracted to be sold to Francis Danby
   20 - Plan of property lots 1-4 at Kilham
   21 - Conveyance of a close of land at Kilham
   22 - Abstract of title of Francis Danby to a close of land containing 21 acres 3 roods 10 perches at Kilham
   23 - Abstract of title of Francis Danby to a close of land at Kilham
   24 - Mortgage of a farmhouse and land at Kilham
   25 - Mortgage of a close of land at Kilham
   26 - Probate copy of the will of William Lyon of Tibthorpe, formerly Garton on the Wolds, publican
   27 - Appointment of two new trustees of the will of Emanuel Lownsbrough of Kilham, yeoman, deceased
   28 - Transfer of mortgage of a close of land at Kilham
   29 - Extract from the will of Robert Holtby of Elmswell, gentleman
   30 - Memorandum of an agreement to lease a grass field at Kilham
   31 - Transfer of mortgage of a farmhouse and land at Kilham
   32 - Schedule of title deeds relating to a farmhouse and land at Kilham belonging to Francis Danby and mortgaged to Robert Holtby
   33 - Probate copy of the will of Esther Pape, wife of Henry Pape of Kilham, labourer
   34 - Probate copy of the will of Henry Pape of Kilham, yeoman
   35 - Conveyance of dwellinghouse, tenements and land at the west end of Kilham
   36 - Mortgage of dwellinghouse, tenements and land at the west end of Kilham
   37 - Mortgage of dwellinghouse, tenements and land at Kilham
   38 - Memorandum of deposit of a conveyance relating to grassland at Kilham
   39 - Extracts from the will of Bielby Topham of Bainton, farmer
   40 - Transfer of mortgage of dwellinghouse, tenements and land at the west end of Kilham
   41 - Abstract of title of Francis Danby to a dwellinghouse and land at Kilham
   42 - Mortgage of closes of land and premises at Kilham
   43 - Notice of second mortgage on farmhouse and lands in Kilham from the solicitors of William Harrison, Huttons Ambo, North Riding, farmer and tenant right valuer
   44 - Notice of second mortgage on Townend Close, Kilham, from the solicitors of William Harrison, Huttons Ambo, North Riding, farmer and tenant right valuer
   45 - Transfer of mortgage of close of land at Kilham
   46 - Transfer of mortgage of messuage, farm and lands at Kilham
   47 - Yorkshire Insurance Company fire policy relating to a farm situated at West End, Kilham
   48 - Requisitions on title to property at Kilham from Danby's trustees to Wilson
   49 - Particulars of search at East Riding Registry of Deeds
   50 - Letter relating to estate duty on property on farm at Kilham
   51 - Copy letters of administration for Thomas Wilson
   52 - Inland Revenue, application for a certificate relating to payment of estate duty for a farm at Kilham
   53 - Memorandum of deposit of title deeds relating to West End Farm, Kilham
   54 - Abstract of title of the personal representative of Thomas Wilson, deceased, to a farm at Kilham, contracted to be sold to T H Wilson
   55 - Abstract of title of the trustees of the will of Francis Danby to farmhouse, cottages and farm at Kilham


Click on any ones you fancy to see more details and an idea of the document dates


The reference for the actual tithe map can be found using kilham tithe map in a new search  (ref is TA/16)

[StephenCND]

Then we are on the same page.. I was able to retrieve the information you posted as well. Note that the 55 references do not mean there is a relevance or contains "pinder(ar) in them, right?
Final question, in DDX2003/8/12, if I ordered a copy, is there more information than is listed in the description Ie. (below) , or is that it?

"Description   He declares that he is 82 years of age and has resided in Kilham all his life. He is well acquainted with the farmhouse and farm at Kilham containing 127 acres, recently agreed to be sold by Miss Newton to William Lamplugh, and occupied by George Hardy. The first owner he can remember was Foord Newton, then Isaac Newton, then William Newton who took the name Watson, and then his sister Jane Newton. Christopher Lamplugh was a cousin of my late father, was the first tenant he can remember, then John Pinder, then William Newton and then George Hardy, who has been the occupier for 35 years. Believes that Christopher Lamplugh was tenant of the farm at the time of the Kilham Inclosure."