Author Topic: Son or Grandson?? Not sure and really need some help  (Read 939 times)

Offline klmadz2301

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Son or Grandson?? Not sure and really need some help
« on: Thursday 22 March 18 05:55 GMT (UK) »
Hi all
I am looking for some help with something that I am hoping is just a census mistake.

I have Edward Fisher and his wife Frances/Francis (nee Rolls). I have them listed as the parents of: Matilda Jane, Edward James, Emma, Frederick, Eliza, John, Ellen, Henry, Arthur and George. These 10 children were born between 1832 and 1849. All 10 children are listed on the 1851 census, and I have found all their baptism records to verify that they are the children of Edward and Frances.

The part that I need help with is on the 1861 England Census, Henry, Arthur and George are still listed with Edward and Frances but they also have William, aged 5 years old (estimated birth year is 1856), as their son. In the 1871 England Census, William is aged 15 and is now listed as their grandson. I have found all the children for the other 10 children and I cant link William to any of Edward and Frances's children. I have found a birth registration for a William Fisher Apr-May-Jun 1855 in Chertsey, Surrey, England. (the 1861 census lists Chertsey, Surrey as his birth place).

I just wanted to know if the error was in listing him as a grandson on the 1871 census or was the error in listing him as a son in 1861. If William was the son of Edward and Frances, then Frances would have been about 49 years old when William was born. It has me a bit confused as to whether he is their son or grandson and if he is their grandson, who are his biological parents?

Thanks in advance for any advice and/or help
Fisher - Australia, England
Redhead - Australia, England
Banks - Australia, England
Offord - Australia, England
O'Dwyer - Ireland
Thompson - Australia
Mitchell - Australia, Ireland
Dinte - Australia, England, Poland

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Offline Pelican

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Re: Son or Grandson?? Not sure and really need some help
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 22 March 18 06:05 GMT (UK) »
Very often it was parents to the rescue. An older daughter would have a baby out of wedlock and Mum and Dad brought it up.  There are older daughters here. Certainly if Mum is 49 then it is probably not her son.

Listed firstly as son and then as grandson. This could be a busy enumerators mistake or mishearing or misunderstanding.

No family stories anywhere?

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Offline Ruskie

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Re: Son or Grandson?? Not sure and really need some help
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 22 March 18 06:08 GMT (UK) »
Why not buy the 1855 birth certificate for William Fisher?

This would tell you his parent's names, or at least the mother's name.  :)

William could be a late child for Edward and Frances - there have been numerous discussions (with examples) on rootschat about older parents, so it can't be dismissed, but the temptation is to believe William is the son of one of their older children.

You may never know unless you purchase the b/c.

Added: A lot can happen in the 10 years between censuses. It is possible that one of the older sons married and had a child in that time. Perhaps the mother died hence the child living with his grandparents.

Offline Kay99

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Re: Son or Grandson?? Not sure and really need some help
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 22 March 18 06:10 GMT (UK) »
On the GRO birth Index in 1885 for William Fisher b Chertsey no mothers maiden name is listed so he
is probably a grandson

Offline klmadz2301

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Re: Son or Grandson?? Not sure and really need some help
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 22 March 18 06:13 GMT (UK) »
Pelican: Nah my Fisher side is extremely boring and straight forward. However, I did have one of the daughters, Ellen, pop up as a nursemaid in another household in the 1861 census, and usually nursemaids at that time were used to feed newborn babies, so that the mother didn't have too. I didn't make the connection until now.

Ruskie: Im not in any great hurry to buy his cert as he is not my direct line, just the sibling/nephew of my direct line, but i was more curious than anything else.

Kay: i noticed that too.
Fisher - Australia, England
Redhead - Australia, England
Banks - Australia, England
Offord - Australia, England
O'Dwyer - Ireland
Thompson - Australia
Mitchell - Australia, Ireland
Dinte - Australia, England, Poland

Offline klmadz2301

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Re: Son or Grandson?? Not sure and really need some help
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 22 March 18 06:16 GMT (UK) »
But Ellen was also only about 18 in 1861 so, William was more than likely, one of the older daughters. Matilda married but had no children, Emma never married or had children and Eliza only have one son.
Fisher - Australia, England
Redhead - Australia, England
Banks - Australia, England
Offord - Australia, England
O'Dwyer - Ireland
Thompson - Australia
Mitchell - Australia, Ireland
Dinte - Australia, England, Poland

Offline Ruskie

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Re: Son or Grandson?? Not sure and really need some help
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 22 March 18 06:16 GMT (UK) »
I think a Nursemaid is a nanny rather than a wet nurse.  :)

There could be any number of possible scenarios - all just guesswork without the certificate ....  :-\

Offline macwil

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Re: Son or Grandson?? Not sure and really need some help
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 22 March 18 06:39 GMT (UK) »
Have you looked for a Baptism?
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Offline klmadz2301

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Re: Son or Grandson?? Not sure and really need some help
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 22 March 18 07:07 GMT (UK) »
Ruskie: i always get the two confused, lol.

Macwil: I have tried to find a baptism but no such luck. Unless I have already found it and dismissed it because i believed that Edward and Frances were William's parents.

Maybe its time to re-look for a baptism. But should I look again for a baptism using the daughters names or would that not be listed because Edward and Frances have chosen to raise William as their own son?

My gut is telling me that William is the son of one of the daughters and not Edward and Frances's son.
Fisher - Australia, England
Redhead - Australia, England
Banks - Australia, England
Offord - Australia, England
O'Dwyer - Ireland
Thompson - Australia
Mitchell - Australia, Ireland
Dinte - Australia, England, Poland