Pioneer Royal engineers

[copperplumber2]

Hello all
I was hoping somebody might be able to help with a question I have.

I try to find any information on military men in my family lines, and have just turned up a great uncle who served in ww1

244040 WR/505654 John Bradburn was in the inland water transport corps Royal Engineers. I have seen his medal index and service records which state that johns rank was PIONEER.

I myself am ex Royal Engineers and I have never come across in my time in service, or history lessons learnt, that pioneer was a rank in stead of SAPPER in RE.

Johns occupation on service records is pottery worker but has been crossed out and replaced with excavator, would this have any affect on Sapper/pioneer rank ?

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance Mark

[MaxD]

The rank was introduced in 1912 and lasted till 1920.  Where the Sapper was trained as a skilled tradesman, the RE Pioneer was employed on unskilled (or at least as far as RE trades were concerned) labour.

As a pottery worker or excavator, he would as far as the Sappers were concerned, be classed as unskilled.

MaxD

[copperplumber2]

Many thanks MaxD
I suppose then, hole diggers = pioneer putting concrete in,laying bricks=clever sappers
;-)

[copperplumber2]

Thinking in a modern army way then,would you have a troop consisting of sappers and pioneers or would there be seperate pioneer squadrons. Thanks

[MaxD]

I don't have a definitive answer but the examples on the Longlongtrail show that a Field Company had no Pioneers whereas an Army Tramways Company RE had (at private soldier rank) 23 Sappers and 60 Pioneers.  Looking at an example RE Signal Company I find a mix of Pioneers and Sappers so my guess would be that the mix depended on the role. I doubt an all Pioneer company though.

MaxD

[copperplumber2]

Thanks for that MaxD, reading your post makes me think a mixture of both in iwt RE if he was an excavator.

I've seen else where on Internet that there different types of company in iwt RE including construction companys, so I rightly or wrongly assume that John Bradburn was probably in one of these, as a pioneer working alongside sappers.

Thanks for your help
Mark

[MaxD]

A pity (but typical) that his records have no clue as to the sub unit of the IWT he served in.  Started at Sandwich (they all did, Richborough was the depot) finished in France and was demobbed to be a miner.

MaxD

[copperplumber2]

Cheers MaxD
I've just gone back through service papers and noticed 2 different ones. One is 1916 the other 1917 but both for John ( I wondered where you had the above information from)
I also noticed earlier service papers from 1900 and 1901 and am pretty sure this my John as father and census address tallys up with my records.
I'll have to see where these service records lead me, as he is in north staffs regt (maybe militia)bit late at night now:-(

Thanks for all your help
Mark

[MaxD]

His service:
Signs up for a regular 12 year engagement in the N Staffs on 19 Feb 1900 but is discharged free (which usually meant unfit) in April 1900.
Signs up for a six year engagement in the N Staffs Militia (part time) July 1901 and serves (ie continues civilian job but turns up for annual training) until 1907 (tells a fib on joining that he has no previous service).
Volunteers under the Derby Scheme on 11 Dec 1915 (the last possible day) but is not called for service until Feb 1917.  The 1916 date appears to be the way the web site has catalogued the record, I see no 1916 significance (apart from his marriage).

MaxD