Author Topic: Peter Copland abt 1782 - 1852  (Read 3334 times)

Offline MonicaL

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Re: Peter Copland abt 1782 - 1852
« Reply #9 on: Wednesday 11 April 18 22:00 BST (UK) »
If you have Peter showing as a shoemaker, think you have probably gone down the wrong road with the other Peter. There is this Peter in the 1841 census. Copelands showing as born in the County:

John Copland 37 shoemaker
Mary Copland 29
John Copland 10
Mary Copland 6
James Copland 4
Samuel Copland 3
William Copland   1
Lewis Fergusson 20
Catherine May 35
Ann Farquharson 20
Peter Copland 79 journeyman shoemaker

Address: Lingamend, Coull Aberdeenshire

You have a John b. 1820 to Peter and Isabel. Can't therefore be the same John as above.

Monica

Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Online Millmoor

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Re: Peter Copland abt 1782 - 1852
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 11 April 18 22:06 BST (UK) »
All of the baptisms you have quoted have been transcribed and can be seen on Freereg. In all of them the abode of Peter Copland and Isobel Shand is given as Knowhead except for Margaret where it is given as Buckie.

Witnesses for the baptisms are as follows

Margaret 18 May 1806 Wit William Copland and Margaret Shand

William 31 Jul 1808 Wit William Copland in Moss side and William Farquhar

Peter 6 Jan 1811 Wit Peter Copland Moss side and Peter Copland in Nethertown of Findochty

Isabel 3 Jun 1812 Wit George Moggach in Knowhead and Alexr McCraw there

Jane 16 Apr 1815 Wit Thomas Copland in Portgordon and James Farquhar

Jannet 20 April 1818 Wit James Duncan and Alex'r McCraw Knowhead

John 11 Mar 1820 Wit John Copland and John Farquhar.

If you give us some more detail from one or more of the childrens death certs. we may be able to help further.

William






Dent (Haltwhistle and Sacriston), Bell and Jetson (Haltwhistle), Postle, Ward, Longstaff, Purvis, Manners, Parnaby and Hardy (Co. Durham), Kennedy and McRobert (Banffshire), Reid(Bathgate), Watson (Wemyss), Graham (Libberton), Sandilands (Carmichael), Munro (Dingwall)

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Peter Copland abt 1782 - 1852
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 11 April 18 22:08 BST (UK) »
Yes, I think you need to go back to basics altogether.

You have no solid evidence to tell you where or when either Peter or Isabel was born, or who their parents were, or when or where they died. I don't know what you mean by Source Citation for Scotland, Select Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 but whatever it is, it is not an original record and cannot be relied on.

Scotland's People does have a record of a baptism of Isabel, daughter of William Shand and Margaret Young, in the parish of New Spynie on 29 January 1787, but there is no guarantee that this is your Isabel. She could just as easily be one of the 10 other Isabel/Isobel Shands whose baptisms between 1775 and 1790 are in the records at www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk, or another one altogether whose baptism record has not survived.

If, and it's a big if, Peter and Isabel followed the naming tradition, you would expect Peter's parents to be William and Isabella, and Isabel's to be Peter and Margaret. But if both their mothers' names were Margaret and/or both their fathers' names were William, the naming tradition doesn't help.

Also, is there any actual evidence to suggest that Peter and Isabel ever lived in Aberdeen? From the absence of any likely-looking listing in the census it looks to me more as if they could both have died in Rathven before the 1841 census.

There is a possible candidate for the labourer who died in Aberdeen in 1852. This is a Peter Copland, aged 68, a day labourer born and living in Monymusk. It is possible that he was taken to the Infirmary in Aberdeen and died there. If you want to follow him up, the Infirmary records are available to consult in the Aberdeen University Library and they tend to be rather more informative than the church burial records.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Peter Copland abt 1782 - 1852
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 11 April 18 22:27 BST (UK) »
Buckie http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=15&lat=57.6770&lon=-2.9740&layers=5&b=1

Knowhead http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=16&lat=57.6876&lon=-2.9241&layers=5&b=1 and http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/4800083

Netherton of Findochty http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=16&lat=57.6988&lon=-2.9035&layers=5&b=1

Portgordon http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=16&lat=57.6641&lon=-3.0196&layers=5&b=1

For the moment Moss-side is defeating me! There are several unnamed cottages on the map, so it could be one of those.

But all except Portgordon are in the same general area, between Buckie and Findochty.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.


Online Millmoor

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Re: Peter Copland abt 1782 - 1852
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday 11 April 18 23:05 BST (UK) »
There is this death from Banffshire: The People and the Lands Part 6 (Rathven)

Copland Peter 1818 Farmer in Moss-side of Gollachy, died in 1818 aged 80 (Possibly the witness for Peter's baptism?)

There are two baptisms showing with parents Peter Copland and Margaret Geddes with an abode given as Mosside of Gollachy

William 26 Sep 1781 Wit William Boyn and Janet Geddes

Thomas 20 May 1788 Wit Thomas McLachlan and Elspet Copland

(Marriage Peter Copland and Margaret Geddes 5 Nov 1768 - that is quite a gap before William comes along!).

William
Dent (Haltwhistle and Sacriston), Bell and Jetson (Haltwhistle), Postle, Ward, Longstaff, Purvis, Manners, Parnaby and Hardy (Co. Durham), Kennedy and McRobert (Banffshire), Reid(Bathgate), Watson (Wemyss), Graham (Libberton), Sandilands (Carmichael), Munro (Dingwall)

Offline Wendy2305

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Re: Peter Copland abt 1782 - 1852
« Reply #14 on: Wednesday 11 April 18 23:13 BST (UK) »
William Copland mothers ms Geddes age 82 died in Rathven 1864

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Peter Copland abt 1782 - 1852
« Reply #15 on: Thursday 12 April 18 08:52 BST (UK) »
Still haven't found Moss-side, but Gollachy is just east of Portgordon
http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=16&lat=57.6664&lon=-3.0031&layers=5&b=1

Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Peter Copland abt 1782 - 1852
« Reply #16 on: Thursday 12 April 18 09:00 BST (UK) »
In all of them the abode of Peter Copland and Isobel Shand is given as Knowhead except for Margaret where it is given as Buckie.
Hmmm. It isn't unknown for a young woman to return to her mother's house for the birth of her first child. If this is what Isabel did, it might imply that her parental home was in Buckie.

Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline themonkeymonkey

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Re: Peter Copland abt 1782 - 1852
« Reply #17 on: Thursday 12 April 18 10:52 BST (UK) »
13 May 1876 Margaret Leitch (Copland) died in Portsoy, father Peter Copland master shoemaker deceased, mother Isabella Copland m.s Shand deceased.  Informant Peter Leitch son.
15 March 1900 Jessie Flett (Copland) died in Rathven, father - Copland shoemaker deceased, mother Isabella Copland m.s. Shand deceased.  Informant William Flett son in law.
So far that is the only information that I have as some children died before 1855 and some died abroad.  Next time I am back in Scotland I will do some legwork and see if I can find any information at Aberdeen University Library and perhaps a scout round Rathven and surrounding cemeteries.
Thank you all for your help its very much appreciated.
Manson, Wilson, Copland, Craighead, Youngson, Ross, Thomson, Smith, Horn