Author Topic: Burial in 1888 listed as Marylebone, how do I find out where the grave is?  (Read 3824 times)

Offline Rattus

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Re: Burial in 1888 listed as Marylebone, how do I find out where the grave is?
« Reply #27 on: Monday 16 April 18 17:03 BST (UK) »
Fair point dawnsh. In general I find Deceased Online really useful, but the limited search facilities are sometimes frustrating. Specifically, the lack of ability to search geographically within the UK.

I've just discovered something new (to me). You CAN search geographically within the UK, but you have to select 'United Kingdom' as the country first. Then further drop-down boxes start to appear, getting progressively more granular down to individual cemetery/crematorium level. Excellent!
BARTRAM - Nottingham, Derby, originally Beds (Stagsden)
PERFETT - St Pancras & Marylebone, Rugby, Nottingham
RADFORD - Nottinghamshire, also back & forth to Bury
RUDD - Durham, Margate, Bermondsey, Newcastle, Nottingham

Offline dawnsh

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Re: Burial in 1888 listed as Marylebone, how do I find out where the grave is?
« Reply #28 on: Monday 16 April 18 17:29 BST (UK) »
You can only do an advanced search with a valid subscription, mine has lapsed as I can't afford that and FindMyPast in the same credit card month
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Sherry-Paddington & Marylebone,
Longhurst-Ealing & Capel, Abinger, Ewhurst & Ockley,
Chandler-Chelsea

Offline Rattus

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Re: Burial in 1888 listed as Marylebone, how do I find out where the grave is?
« Reply #29 on: Monday 16 April 18 17:34 BST (UK) »
You can only do an advanced search with a valid subscription, mine has lapsed as I can't afford that and FindMyPast in the same credit card month

Ah yes, that too. But I had completely missed the point that you only get the fields for region, county etc after you've selected UK.
BARTRAM - Nottingham, Derby, originally Beds (Stagsden)
PERFETT - St Pancras & Marylebone, Rugby, Nottingham
RADFORD - Nottinghamshire, also back & forth to Bury
RUDD - Durham, Margate, Bermondsey, Newcastle, Nottingham

Offline Rattus

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Re: Burial in 1888 listed as Marylebone, how do I find out where the grave is?
« Reply #30 on: Tuesday 17 April 18 14:32 BST (UK) »
I visited Hampstead Cemetery this morning. In short, nothing directly useful. However, like yesterday, there is some additional information that begs further questions, maybe.

The plot was easy to locate. The map was accurate, the grid system is tightly packed and plenty of the neighbouring plots have stonework indicating their plot numbers. I have no doubt that I found the right grave.

This area was under some trees and was rather overgrown: holly, ivy, brambles, nettles. I always forget to bring gloves. Neighbouring memorials were mostly covered with ivy but it was fairly easy to remove. Plot N6/28 appeared to have no memorial.

Then after a while I noticed a bump at the foot of the grave, rather than the head. When I cleared it, I found a small memorial, only about a foot high. Obviously once the base of a cross or similar, but the top part was long gone. The wording, on the (stone) pages of a book, was:

Left side:
BABY
NELLIE
DIED
22ND
Right side:
APRIL
1884
AGE 8
MONTHS

Underneath:
THIS LOVELY BUD SO YOUNG AND FAIR
THUS EARLY CALL'D TO DOOM
JUST CAME TO SHOW HOW SWEET A FLOWER
IN PARADISE COULD BLOOM

Obviously rather unexpected, given that the Strawbridge plot was purchased in 1888. I did a couple of cursory searches (e.g. female Strawbridge deaths in 1884) but there's nothing immediately obvious.

My theory is that this is actually the monument from the apparently unmarked grave in the next row, and that over time it has moved from the head of that plot (which would be N5/28) to the foot of its neighbour (i.e. N6/28).

Could be confirmed by asking the cemetery service to check that plot, but as the original objective was to find pointers to the burial place of George Nelson Strawbridge, I'll leave it there for now. If anyone thinks it's worth researching the above info further, I'm open to persuasion.
BARTRAM - Nottingham, Derby, originally Beds (Stagsden)
PERFETT - St Pancras & Marylebone, Rugby, Nottingham
RADFORD - Nottinghamshire, also back & forth to Bury
RUDD - Durham, Margate, Bermondsey, Newcastle, Nottingham


Offline dawnsh

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Re: Burial in 1888 listed as Marylebone, how do I find out where the grave is?
« Reply #31 on: Tuesday 17 April 18 15:06 BST (UK) »
from the GRO index & deceasedonline

Nellie Margaret Mary Wentworth, buried 24 April 1884

don't have a current sub for further details such as plot number etc
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Sherry-Paddington & Marylebone,
Longhurst-Ealing & Capel, Abinger, Ewhurst & Ockley,
Chandler-Chelsea

Offline rosie99

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Re: Burial in 1888 listed as Marylebone, how do I find out where the grave is?
« Reply #32 on: Tuesday 17 April 18 16:11 BST (UK) »
She was 8 months old
Plot N6 26
abode 1 Well Walk Terrace, Hampstead
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Rattus

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Re: Burial in 1888 listed as Marylebone, how do I find out where the grave is?
« Reply #33 on: Tuesday 17 April 18 17:38 BST (UK) »
OK, I was convinced that I had the right plot but this casts doubt on that. Either Nellie's memorial has indeed travelled slightly, or I lost track of where I was. It all seemed quite clear at the time.

I'll go back to the cemetery and do a fuller inventory of the area, then see if the cemetery office can help out with lookups rather than spending a fortune on Deceased Online credits.

I'll also pay a bit more attention to the overgrown and apparently unmarked neighbouring plots, in case I missed something amongst all the undergrowth. Note to self: gloves.
BARTRAM - Nottingham, Derby, originally Beds (Stagsden)
PERFETT - St Pancras & Marylebone, Rugby, Nottingham
RADFORD - Nottinghamshire, also back & forth to Bury
RUDD - Durham, Margate, Bermondsey, Newcastle, Nottingham

Offline Rattus

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Re: Burial in 1888 listed as Marylebone, how do I find out where the grave is?
« Reply #34 on: Wednesday 18 April 18 14:25 BST (UK) »
Problem identified and solved, but the bottom line is that there is still no memorial to report.

I asked one of the cemetery workers if there was a public loo. He let me into the gatehouse to use the staff facilities and while there I saw a massive plot map on the wall. With permission, I studied it more closely. It is subtly different to the printed map the that office staff had provided.

On the printed map, there is a very clear grid system with incremental section numbers (N4, N5, N6, etc) and incremental plot numbers that operate in parallel, so N4/28 is next to N5/28, which is next to N6/28, and so on. It looks like a neat and tidy row/column layout.

However, the map in the cemetery gatehouse reveals that the actual layout is 'off' by one number per section. When I found a clearly marked N4/28, I concluded that the sought plot N6/28 was two sections up (per the printed map). It's actually two up and two along.

This explains why I found Nellie Wentworth's memorial (on N6/26) at the plot where I was expecting to find N6/28. A wider review of headstone plot numbers in the area confirms this. Yesterday I took it for granted that the map was correct. As ever: check and double check.

The correct plot is even more overgrown. However, there was no sign of a memorial. The neighbouring plot N6/29 was similarly overgrown but the memorial was unmistakeable and easy to clear, so it seems that there is no memorial for Ann Strawbridge.

I've done a Deceased Online lookup for the surname on the headstone that I worked out was N6/29 and it confirms the plot number.
BARTRAM - Nottingham, Derby, originally Beds (Stagsden)
PERFETT - St Pancras & Marylebone, Rugby, Nottingham
RADFORD - Nottinghamshire, also back & forth to Bury
RUDD - Durham, Margate, Bermondsey, Newcastle, Nottingham

Offline Kat7272

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Re: Burial in 1888 listed as Marylebone, how do I find out where the grave is?
« Reply #35 on: Sunday 22 April 18 20:10 BST (UK) »
Hi all

Just checked in after a period away from the forum to do some decorating.

Thank you all very much for your help, I am very grateful, but particularly, thanks to Rattus. Excellent research Rattus, very good of you to go to the trouble of looking for the grave.

Interesting reading regarding your search.  As there were several stone masons in the family, I had hoped the graves would have a headstone.

Joseph, born 1792 buried in Staffs has a be a beautiful head stone. I was hoping this would be the case for George and Anne. The 9 Strawbridge's buried in Warstone Lane, Birmingham, haven't any stones, admittedly I have only checked the grave of Patience, but I can't find details of any headstones for the other 8. I will make a visit in the better weather, I have a contact that volunteers to maintain the cemetery and he has been a great help on giving me details of what to take notice of on the map for the grave plots.

Again, thank you all for your help. Well done Rattus. If I find any more details on the subject, I will let you know.

Kat