Author Topic: Re: JOHN STEVENSON, MOTHERWELL  (Read 2406 times)

Offline MidgeZA

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Re: JOHN STEVENSON, MOTHERWELL
« on: Sunday 15 April 18 12:33 BST (UK) »
Re: JOHN STEVENSON from MOTHERWELL  LANARKSHIRE , SCOTLAND. (Calculated born about 1850-1860 as my grandmother-Myrtle Matilda Grace Stroud née Stevenson was the 6th of 8 children, born 5 June 1893). Any information appreciated.

I noted from Scotlands places that a small portion of Motherwell falls in Hamilton parish but the largest portion, most of Motherwell village falls in Dalziel parish. (There were a few brickworks in the area & a number of railway lines that would seem to have influenced my great grandfather's chosen profession/direction). Dalziel is bounded by Bothwell in the northwest, Hamilton in the south & Cam'nethan (Cambusnethan) in the west.

My maternal grandmother's father, John Stevenson, emigrated to South Africa, date unknown.
He was a master builder living in Bloemfontein, 0range River Colony/Orange Free State, South Africa, (around 1901- according to a pass I saw allowing him to visit the brickfields & sportsfields during the 1899-1902 Anglo-Boer War); whom she said built Bloemfontein railway station building with a partner who ran off with the money.

My grandmother's siblings are:
1/8 Alice. Married unknown. 3 children: Stanley, Joyce & Doris.

2/8 James. Married Susan or Susanne. 2 children: Johnny-died of cancer of the teeth & Jimmy born 10 Nov (1930?). Married Betty & living with son Robert in Cape Town, South Africa.

3/8 Maud(e). Married Herbert Taylor & went to live in Rhodesia. 2 children: 1-Agnes. Married unknown & had 3 daughters. Patricia moved to Boksburg South Africa. 2-Donald.

4 or 5/8 Laura. Married an Englishman & emigrated to UK. Children: Yes-no further details.

5 or 4/8 Agnes. Married? Emigrated to UK & died, (when my mother-born 6 Nov 1936, was very young).

6/8 My grandmother, Myrtle Matilda Grace-born 5 Jun 1893. Married George William Stroud-born 22 Jun 1892 UK, on 5 Jun 1915 Bloemfontein, SA.
7 children & many descendants.

7/8 Olive. Married Willie. 2 children: 1st-Daphne. Married 'Andy' Horace Badman. 2 children: 1-Michael-born 5 Mar 1962 who married 'Alex' (Portuguese?) & had 2 children: Michelle  & Samantha & 2-Graham- born UK. Grandchildren: Yes-Chris married Myrna & emigrated to Australia.
2nd-Willy. Married Violet.

8/8 Doug. Married Rita (Margarita?). 2 daughters: 1-Maureen & 2-Elaine. Both married 2 brothers named Prinsloo. Pretoria, South Africa.

This is as far as I have gotten with the Stevenson's descendants. I have included everything I know as I have struggled to find any information as I am unable to view paid sites.

Thanking you in advance.

P.S. I am often updating my Wikitree profile - Lange-1038. I also have a my heritage entry under Lange, Karen (incorrectly listed as from USA)

Offline CaroleW

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Re: JOHN STEVENSON, MOTHERWELL
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 15 April 18 14:23 BST (UK) »
You don't give any details of his wife.  Where did he marry and when?  If he married in Scotland his marriage will be on Scotlands People and downloading the cert will give you his parents names

Were all the children born in SA or were any born in Scotland?  Apart from Myrtle - no birthyears shown for her older siblings

What documentation do you have which shows his birthplace as Motherwell?

Quote
(Calculated born about 1850-1860

Stevenson is not an uncommon surname and with a 10yr span for his birthyear we need more info.  When did he die and how old was he when he died?
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Offline MidgeZA

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Re: JOHN STEVENSON, MOTHERWELL
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 27 May 18 04:57 BST (UK) »
Hi Carole W. Thank you, I greatly appreciate you taking the time to reply to try to help me & I apologise for not replying sooner (& this lengthy reply). I understand I am asking for the impossible here with so little information to go on.

I have no documentation for John, just that my late Granny, Myrtle, told my brother he was from Motherwell, Scotland.

I am fairly certain John married before emigrating to South Africa but I have no details of his wife.
I am unable to download the certificate or view any information that requires a subscription/pay for view, because it is prohibitively expensive.

I know he was living & working as a master builder in Bloemfontein in the late 1800's, (where he & his partner built the railway station building), as the Cape to Bloemfontein railway was built in 1890, & from his 1901 pass; which he was required to carry to allow him passage to the brickworks during the Anglo-boer war. It may help to know the duration/type of apprenticeship he would have had to serve to become a master builder in Scotland but I have no idea where to find this out.

My mother, (Myrtle's daughter), says as far as she is aware all John's children were born in Bloemfontein, South Africa.
A few of them returned to the UK or went to Rhodesia, although it is difficult to find any information not knowing their married names.

I have no idea when or how old John was when he died, or dates for his children's births etc, other than my granny's. But I have just found Doug Stevenson's daughters, whom I hope can give me more information. My mother recently heard from her cousin Jimmy, James Stevenson's son, so hope he can tell me more too.

Finding any information in South Africa is extremely difficult as they don't have a system like the UK's Free BMD. (Apparently there used to be a website called Ancestry24 but it was bought by Ancestry UK so no longer exists).

Just finding a reference is proving nigh impossible. Most of the birth dates, (which I have deduced as being at least 2 years apart from each other), were before mandatory registration dates. Mandatory registration of births, marriages, deaths was instituted at different times in South Africa depending on where one lived. The Cape colony dates differed from Natal, Orange Free State etc.

If one is fortunate enough to find a reference, from this one must get the details as to where the record is held, type of document, Volume, Folio etc & order the record for a fee.
This I was told can take 6 months to a year to obtain. Now exacerbated by the queues for the new ID card system. In order to ensure one is attended to, & get 1 of the 300 tickets to gain entry to the Department of Home Affairs at 7am, one has to be there at 4am.

Even locating newspapers of the period is difficult, as not all have been listed or scanned & posted online. I don't know where to look for church records as I don't know what denomination John's family were. Although I do know they couldn't speak Afrikaans, so unlikely Dutch Reformed Church in SA, maybe Church of England?

I will add any information I find out. Thank you.

Offline Forfarian

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Re: JOHN STEVENSON, MOTHERWELL
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 27 May 18 08:49 BST (UK) »
I am fairly certain John married before emigrating to South Africa but I have no details of his wife. I am unable to download the certificate or view any information that requires a subscription/pay for view, because it is prohibitively expensive.
To download an image of one Scottish birth, marriage or death certificate costs GBP1.50, which is less than the cost of a cup of coffee. That's not 'prohibitively expensive', though addiction to the Scotland's People web site can certainly become expensive.

However I would strongly advise against trying to find his marriage certificate, let alone his birth, without knowing the name of his wife. There are 459 marriages of John Stevensons in Scotland between the start of civil registration and 1890. Even if you restrict yourself to 1870 to 1880 there are still 155 such marriages. And that doesn't include spelling variations.

So it's got to be back to South African records to find that out, I'm afraid.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.


Offline scotmum

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Re: JOHN STEVENSON, MOTHERWELL
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 27 May 18 09:05 BST (UK) »
Familysearch have some baptism entries for,  based on names you have listed, potentially, the family in question.

 Alice Elizabeth Jane Stevenson born 23/4  bapt. 17/5/1884
 
a James Alexander Stevenson born 17/8/1886 bapt. 12/9/1886

an Agnes Florence Stevenson born 23/2 bapt. 3/4/1888

a Laura Mary Stevenson born 25/6/1889 bapt. 4/8/1889

a Violet Stevenson born 30/7/1894 bapt. 4/8/1894 buried 6/8/1894


All above @ St Andrew and St Margaret**, Bloemfontein and noted with parents John Stevenson (a carpenter) and Sarah Ann/e Stevenson.

There is also an Olive Emily Stevenson bapt. 21/5/1899 but at St Andrew and St Michael, Bloemfontein, and parents John Stevenson (a mason) and Emily Matilda Stevenson.

The Donaldson surname appears in names of witnesses, even for the Olive Stevenson baptism.

(** wondering if this should read as "Michael")



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Offline Forfarian

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Re: JOHN STEVENSON, MOTHERWELL
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 27 May 18 09:22 BST (UK) »
Good finds, scotmum.

I looked on FS but it didn't come up with any results!

There are just 3 marriages of John Stevensons to Sara* in Scotland 1870-1885
John Stevenson to Sarah Wilson, Ardrossan, 1870
John G Stevenson to Sarah Black, Dennistoun (Glasgow), 1879
John Telfer Stevenson to Sarah O'Brien or Gough, Blackfriars (Glasgow), 1880 - can probably be eliminated because John Telfer Stevenson, aged 47, died in Springburn (Glasgow) in 1911, and this tallies with a birth in 1864 (he was exceptionally young to marry in 1880 at just 16). His death certificate would nail that.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline scotmum

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Re: JOHN STEVENSON, MOTHERWELL
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 27 May 18 10:15 BST (UK) »
Also available to view on Family Search:

A John Stevenson married a Sarah Ann Donaldson on 12/7/1883 @ St Andrew & St Michael, Bloemfontein (unfortunately, unlike Scottish certificates,  information re parents is not captured on the document).

A Laura Mary Stevenson married a Horace James Tomey there on 16/12/1912 and would seem to be same couple who were living in England at time of 1939 register. A Laura Mary Tomey died March quarter 1976 in Elstree & Potters Bar district.

And Agnes Florence Stevenson married Albert James Ford there the previous year, on 6th December 1911.
"Trees without roots fall over!"
 
""People who never look backward to their ancestors will never look forward to posterity." - Edmund Burke

Don't just wait for the storm to pass, learn to dance in the rain.

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In a world where you can be anything, be kind .

Offline DonM

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Re: JOHN STEVENSON, MOTHERWELL
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 27 May 18 14:03 BST (UK) »
As for John, there is a tool in ancestry, to search the Scottish census by occupation.  You can search by Carpenter, Wright, Mason and Builder.  How accurate is this...its ancestry so no doubt there will be some missed and typical transcription errors.

I see John had a pass for the brickworks, so it was my search I would start with a mason.  The term Builder can be associated with any of the construction trades.

Don
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Offline scotmum

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Re: JOHN STEVENSON, MOTHERWELL
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 27 May 18 15:17 BST (UK) »
Quote
  6/8 My grandmother, Myrtle Matilda Grace-born 5 Jun 1893

Myrtle Matilda Grace Stevenson bapt 19/8/1893 parents John Stevenson (a builder) and Sarah Ann Stevenson

incorrectly indexed on Family search as Myrtle Matilda Sarah Ann Stevenson.

Quote
.  3/8 Maud(e).     

Maud Harriet Stevenson born 30/8/1890 bapt 12/10/1890 parents John Stevenson (Carpenter) and Sarah Ann Stevenson

incorrectly inexed on Family search as Mario Harriet Stevenson.

"Trees without roots fall over!"
 
""People who never look backward to their ancestors will never look forward to posterity." - Edmund Burke

Don't just wait for the storm to pass, learn to dance in the rain.

“Remember to look up at the stars and not down at your feet. Be curious and however difficult life may seem, there is always something you can do and succeed at.”  Stephen Hawking

In a world where you can be anything, be kind .