Norfolk Island prisoners

[Rufous Treecreeper]

Van Diemen's Land former convict (conditional pardon held) John Lamb had his death sentence for murder commuted to transportation for life on 5 July 1838.
He was sent to Norfolk Island via Sydney on the Lord William Bentinck, (with ten other Crown prisoners), which arrived in Sydney on 26 Sep 1838. 
I believe he would have been despatched to Norfolk Island from Sydney on 17 Oct 1838 on the Governor Phillip, along with about 70 other prisoners (one newspaper says 70, another 75 and the NSW Archives ships to Norfolk Island index says 74).

I have been unable to find an online resource for John Lamb's time of Norfolk Island.  Ideally, I'd love to see his convict records.  I really want to know what happened to him!  Is there any way to access them from regional Victoria?

Another question I have is whether, if he didn't die on Norfolk Island, did he get sent back to VDL when Norfolk Island convict station got wound-up, and if so, would he have been sent to Port Arthur and remained there until his death?

Thank you for any help,
Marlene

[Rufous Treecreeper]

Just found him on Ancestry NSW Gaol Description and Entrance Books, so he certainly made it to Sydney!

(No info for after gaol though)

[Rufous Treecreeper]

Have found him on a Norfolk Island record via Ancestry.

Has his name, ship to Australia, trial date (Hobart), sentence and intriguingly under Remarks it has "allowed" written.  His name has been crossed out as well.  It dates from 1843/1844.

Others on the page had "ineligible" written.  Looking further back at the start of the list he appears on it is titled "A nominal return of the penal prisoners now at Norfolk Island showing their date of trial and sentence".

Other lists of prisoners in the same resource have titles about men wanting to go to NSW rather than VDL because they have wives there.  These also have the "allowed" and "ineligible" written under remarks and crossed  out names.

So I think I have to look for him being shipped back to VDL now 

[matthewj64]

Was he involved in the murder of Mr J E Wilson as noted here?
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article232485883

If so, then would this be his convict conduct record?
http://search.archives.tas.gov.au/ImageViewer/image_viewer.htm?CON31-1-27,224,94,L,70

M

[Rufous Treecreeper]

Hi Matthew and thanks 
Yes, that's him and that's his conduct record too.
Unfortunately it doesn't cover his secondary transportation sentence to Norfolk Island. (I should have said I had the VDL one already, sorry.).
It's his Norfolk Island one I'd like now.

I searched the Tas Con17/1/1 (if memory serves), which is N.I. Prisoners sent to VDL 1844 to 1848.  It's not indexed  .  I may have missed him.

The N.I. Changeover (NSW admin to VDL admin) happened in mid to late 1844.  I'm wondering if they "allowed" John Lamb to go to NSW before changeover...

[matthewj64]

Just to add to the picture, have found him on Ancestry in 'Phoenix Hulk: Weekly Transportation Entrance Books, 1837-1840'
24th-30th September 1838, forwarded 15th October 1838

1591 John Lamb
ship - Prince Regent, 1820
original conviction - Worcester, March 1819, housebreaking, life

April 8 1838, Criminal Court Hobart Town, Accessory to murder, Transportation to Norfolk Island, life

M

[Rufous Treecreeper]

Thank you Matthew  that is fantastic info!  On all the earlier records for him it never said what his original crime was so I very much appreciate you finding the hulk record which tells us he was done for housebreaking
Many thanks,
Marlene

[majm]

Hi,  I am not familiar with the detailed records at NSW Archives for secondary transportees from NI to NSW, but have you gone through their holdings noted at the following guide:
 https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/archives/collections-and-research/guides-and-indexes/norfolk-island-guide including:

https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/series/2782--- Reel 770

Sorry I cannot offer much more at the moment.  I will pull thinking cap down harder.

JM

[mabeljessie]

About the time you write of your ancestor John Lamb being at Norfolk Island was a time of great change. Alexander Maconochie was appointed as Commandant under several strict rules as he was a penal reformer. He was not allowed to apply his principles to the hardened twice sentenced convicts. They were separated from the other 600 new convicts who were transported directly from the UK, one of my ancestors was one of them.
Sir Justice John Barry has written a riveting Biography on Maconochie, which is fascinating on Norfolk Island, penal reform as well as Maconochie himself. It also explains how when Maconochie was removed from the penal/island in 1844 most of his convicts available for discharge left with him, taking the course he recommended for them.
After Maconochie's departure Norfolk Island again returned to its former feared place of terror.
If anyone has a Norfolk Island convict this book is well worth a read to give you some context of the island over its many years.