Author Topic: Pre census record ancestors  (Read 838 times)

Offline agray1949

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Pre census record ancestors
« on: Friday 01 June 18 16:15 BST (UK) »
Hi
I am fairly new at Family history research & have so far been lucky enough to do all my research from my computer tracing my ancestors back to the early 1800's where they have been seen in the census records & birth/death certificates.
How can I be sure that the person I see in the Old Parish Registers is the correct one if I cannot see any other records.
A case in mind is William Geddes who was born abt. 1782 in Rathven, Banffshire.
His parents are John Geddes & Ann Chapman according to S/P.
He appears in the 1841 & 1851 Census which says where he was born & the family members tie up.
He died (according to some family trees) in 1854 but I can see no trace on S/P
The thing is, how can I be sure this is the correct birth & death.

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Offline Peter V Crabb

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Re: Pre census record ancestors
« Reply #1 on: Friday 01 June 18 16:41 BST (UK) »
As you go back the risk of errors increases. My main family line stops at a brick wall because there are several babies born with the same christian and surnames in a period of about 3 years.

The Scottish method of keeping the wife / mother's maiden name on records makes life a lot easier and I would put a reasonable probability on that being a match from your description.

I would never trust any information purely on the basis of other trees without confirmation. I have seen too many silly mistakes including my grandmother's supposed postwar second marriage and family (I think that I might have noticed).

Sometimes in Ancestry I will put in a potential parent and see if any searches or hints come up to prove it. If not it goes out again.
Crabb from Laurencekirk / Fordoun and Scurry from mid Essex

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Offline Wendy2305

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Re: Pre census record ancestors
« Reply #2 on: Friday 01 June 18 18:19 BST (UK) »
Hi sometimes you can get clues for parents from the names of the persons children Do any of them have surnames as middle names or are there any witness named on the children's baptism records with matching surnames

Offline agray1949

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Re: Pre census record ancestors
« Reply #3 on: Friday 01 June 18 19:26 BST (UK) »
I agree that having the mother's maiden name is a great help for records after 1855 but even then I have had occasions where there were errors due to the informant giving the wrong name etc.
I have not seen any obvious clues as yet with regard to other names or witnesses which will help.
I have entered the names with parents where I can but have put a warning in that it may not be 100% accurate.

Offline Millmoor

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Re: Pre census record ancestors
« Reply #4 on: Friday 01 June 18 19:27 BST (UK) »
Is he the farmer at Tarrymont in the 1851 census? If so it looks like he may have left a will(date 19/4/1855).

Given that burial records can be few and far between in pre 1855 Scotland wills can be of help if you can find them. MIs and death noticesrs in newspape are worth looking for. In Banffshire the excellent libindx site is always worth examining. The People and the Lands series (essentially a digest of the kirk session records for Banffshire parishes ) can be very helpful - you can find them on FindMyPast.

William
Dent (Haltwhistle and Sacriston), Bell and Jetson (Haltwhistle), Postle, Ward, Longstaff, Purvis, Manners, Parnaby and Hardy (Co. Durham), Kennedy and McRobert (Banffshire), Reid(Bathgate), Watson (Wemyss), Graham (Libberton), Sandilands (Carmichael), Munro (Dingwall)

Offline agray1949

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Re: Pre census record ancestors
« Reply #5 on: Friday 01 June 18 20:34 BST (UK) »
Thanks Millmoor
Yes he is the farmer from Tarrymont. I will have to try & see that will. Do you know if it is available on Ancestry as I do not have find my past. Although saying that I think I may have to go to S/P to get the actual will.

Offline Millmoor

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Re: Pre census record ancestors
« Reply #6 on: Friday 01 June 18 20:53 BST (UK) »
I found the will in the index on SP.  There is a very useful calendar of confirmations on Ancestry but that only starts in 1876.

William
Dent (Haltwhistle and Sacriston), Bell and Jetson (Haltwhistle), Postle, Ward, Longstaff, Purvis, Manners, Parnaby and Hardy (Co. Durham), Kennedy and McRobert (Banffshire), Reid(Bathgate), Watson (Wemyss), Graham (Libberton), Sandilands (Carmichael), Munro (Dingwall)

Offline Elwyn Soutter

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Re: Pre census record ancestors
« Reply #7 on: Friday 01 June 18 21:08 BST (UK) »

A case in mind is William Geddes who was born abt. 1782 in Rathven, Banffshire.
His parents are John Geddes & Ann Chapman according to S/P.
He appears in the 1841 & 1851 Census which says where he was born & the family members tie up.
He died (according to some family trees) in 1854 but I can see no trace on S/P


Statutory death registration didnít start till 1855. Prior to that you have to rely on church records. Not every parishes records have survived and not all parishes kept burial records anyway. So itís perfectly possible that he died in 1854 and thereís no record of it on SP.

No easy answer. You just have to tie it in with other available information. If he was alive in 1851 and his wife was a widow in 1861, and thereís no death record on SP 1855 Ė 1861, then you could infer he died 1851 Ė 1854. Or you might find a gravestone or a will etc.
Elwyn

Offline goldie61

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Re: Pre census record ancestors
« Reply #8 on: Friday 01 June 18 22:07 BST (UK) »
Sometimes you can find a clue with occupations.
For example, if the son was a weaver, did he follow in the footsteps of his father, also a weaver?
Sometimes sons went off to follow a different occupation of course.

Another clue is the place they lived.
Is a place of residence given in the OPRs for the baptisms of the children? Not just the parish, but the actual name of the farm. Remember to check not just the one person you are in interested in, but also any siblings they might have - I have found places of residence are not always given, but are very helpful if they are, especially if the family stayed on the same farm for several generations. Or even if they didn't, and moved farms each time a child was born.
Marriage entries may also give the place they lived.

You might like to check out the site Scotlands places. It holds a wealth of information not just about places, right down to individual farmsteads or cottages, but also about all the people who lived there. (and it is all free to use and view!)
For example, here is a page from the Land Tax rolls of 1773 for Banffshire which mentions a John, James and Alexander Geddes at 'Tullock'. (I put in 'Geddes" as search term, but you can also search by place).
https://scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/digital-volumes/historical-tax-rolls/land-tax-rolls-1645-1831/land-tax-rolls-banffshire-volume-04/4
I see it also mentions 'Tarrymont' on that page.
(This is just an example. Not saying it is your John Geddes! You will have to do a lot more digging.)
Lane, Burgess: Cheshire. Finney, Rogers, Gilman:Derbys
Cochran, Nicol, Paton, Bruce:Scotland. Bertolle:London
Bainbridge, Christman, Jeffs: Staffs