Author Topic: Isabella Anderson of Gamrie. A very complicated lady!  (Read 9405 times)

Offline Liviani

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Isabella Anderson of Gamrie. A very complicated lady!
« on: Monday 25 June 18 02:21 BST (UK) »
Ok, this lady has caused me many sources of frustration, so much so that I've wanted to go back in time and give her a good old shake! Beware, there are umpteen Isabellas in this story.  ;D

I've exhausted researching her and the last thing I'm needing to find is her Death Cert. She seems to vanish. She has led a very interesting life for the time that's for sure. So here goes with what I have, this will be long!

She is my 3x great-grandmother.

Isabella Anderson was born 1826 in Gamrie. Her parents were:

  • Robert Anderson
  • Elizabeth Ferrier (1808 - 1870)

She has a number of illegitimate children with a Francis Anderson who is very much older than her. I actually suspected incest at one point. The details of these children are;

Patrick b.1855 Gamrie
Isabella Frances b.1857 Gamrie
Margaret Ann b. Oct 1859

Isabella Frances dies in 1860. Found a newspaper report saying she ran into the fire and was so badly burnt she died a few days later. Terrible story.

Then Isabella Anderson and Francis Anderson marry in December 1859. Francis is widowed and is aged 68 whilst Isabella is aged 33! Address of Francis is given as 28 Gellymill Street and Isabella's is given as 38 Gellymill Street. I suspect this to be lies and they were actually living together, but who knows.

They then have a legitimate daughter together in Feb 1863 - Mary Frances. Unfortunately Francis Anderson dies only a few months later in the May 1863!

Isabella Anderson goes on to have another illegitimate child in 1866 in Gamrie. An Isabella.

Francis Anderson's first wife was Isobel Massie (1803 - 1842).

This couple had the following children;

Mary. 1826
Isabella. 1832 (yes, another one!)  ::)
Margaret. 1832
Christian. 1834
Francis. 1840
John. 1842

Back to my Isabella Anderson. I have her in the following census:

1851

Snubs, Gamrie.

Isabella is the daughter in law of the head here (though it is actually her step-father). A Francis Jamieson, 50, Farmer of 5 acres.
This is a large household and Isabella's grandmother Elizabeth Farrier nee Mair is here aged 73.
Isabella's occupation is down as not known.
There are 2 young children in this household. An Eliza Anderson aged 4 and a George Anderson aged 1. Wouldn't be surprised if these were 2 children by Isabella here. But can't confirm.  ???


1861

Gellymill Street, Macduff, Gamrie

Francis, 69. Pauper.
With some of his children from his first marriage.
Patrick and a 1 year old Christian who I believe to actually be Margaret Ann.

1871

19 Carmelite Street, Banff.

Isabella aged 45 is widowed and is a pauper.

She is living with daughters Mary aged 8 and Isabella aged 5.


After this, she disappears. I cannot find her death certificate or anything that could be her in 1881. I wonder if she emigrated, but cannot find much anywhere at all. Her name is pretty common  making this more difficult.

She's a bit of a mystery this lady, and the Kirk Session records for Gamrie would probably make for very interesting reading.

I have also wondered if Francis Anderson was actually the father of all of her children or whether he just took them on? It's a bit puzzling, he wasn't a very well off man himself and to take on all those children through marriage.  ???

If anyone could help with this last piece of Isabella's puzzle I'd be extremely grateful.

Many thanks,

Liv. 

Edit: Francis Anderson's parents were William Anderson and Christian Bruce (1754 - ?)
Also, Isabella was illiterate as she was signing with 'her mark' on both her marriage cert in 1859 and on the birth cert of her daughter Margaret Ann.
mtDNA subclade K1b2b. Father's Y-DNA I-S25383
GEDmatch kit; CF7867455
Father's kit; RY1336515
Mother's kit; AF2312865


Kincardineshire
Sheret, Hosie, Valentine, Crow, Beattie, McArthur, Wyllie.
Angus (Forfarshire)
Adam, Valentine, Ewan, Elder, Guild, Kydd, Bradford, Stronner, Gibson, Cloudsley, Evans, Stewart, Stott.
Perthshire
Small, Robertson, Murray, Kennedy, McGregor
Ross & Cromarty
Cameron, Stewart, Grant
Banffshire - Gamrie
Anderson, Massie

Offline Rosinish

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Re: Isabella Anderson of Gamrie. A very complicated lady!
« Reply #1 on: Monday 25 June 18 02:32 BST (UK) »
Liviani,

I haven't quite read through everything as it's a lot to take in on 1 sitting  ;D

My 1st question is...

Do you have this official record from SP (1855 birth) as it should have a lot of info?...

"She has a number of illegitimate children with a Francis Anderson who is very much older than her. I actually suspected incest at one point. The details of these children are;

Patrick b.1855 Gamrie

Annie

South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, Cumming, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"

Offline Liviani

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Re: Isabella Anderson of Gamrie. A very complicated lady!
« Reply #2 on: Monday 25 June 18 02:47 BST (UK) »
Liviani,

I haven't quite read through everything as it's a lot to take in on 1 sitting  ;D

My 1st question is...

Do you have this official record from SP (1855 birth) as it should have a lot of info?...

"She has a number of illegitimate children with a Francis Anderson who is very much older than her. I actually suspected incest at one point. The details of these children are;

Patrick b.1855 Gamrie

Annie

Just got it now.

Patrick born 18th June 1855. He was born in Gardenstown, Gamrie. Illegitimate. Signed with her mark. She was the informant. She was aged 29 here.
mtDNA subclade K1b2b. Father's Y-DNA I-S25383
GEDmatch kit; CF7867455
Father's kit; RY1336515
Mother's kit; AF2312865


Kincardineshire
Sheret, Hosie, Valentine, Crow, Beattie, McArthur, Wyllie.
Angus (Forfarshire)
Adam, Valentine, Ewan, Elder, Guild, Kydd, Bradford, Stronner, Gibson, Cloudsley, Evans, Stewart, Stott.
Perthshire
Small, Robertson, Murray, Kennedy, McGregor
Ross & Cromarty
Cameron, Stewart, Grant
Banffshire - Gamrie
Anderson, Massie

Offline Liviani

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Re: Isabella Anderson of Gamrie. A very complicated lady!
« Reply #3 on: Monday 25 June 18 02:48 BST (UK) »
Her future husband Francis was widowed by 1851 and he was living at Haddolays in 1851. Whether or not this gives any clues.
mtDNA subclade K1b2b. Father's Y-DNA I-S25383
GEDmatch kit; CF7867455
Father's kit; RY1336515
Mother's kit; AF2312865


Kincardineshire
Sheret, Hosie, Valentine, Crow, Beattie, McArthur, Wyllie.
Angus (Forfarshire)
Adam, Valentine, Ewan, Elder, Guild, Kydd, Bradford, Stronner, Gibson, Cloudsley, Evans, Stewart, Stott.
Perthshire
Small, Robertson, Murray, Kennedy, McGregor
Ross & Cromarty
Cameron, Stewart, Grant
Banffshire - Gamrie
Anderson, Massie


Offline Rosinish

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Re: Isabella Anderson of Gamrie. A very complicated lady!
« Reply #4 on: Monday 25 June 18 02:58 BST (UK) »
My next question (as said prior, too much to take in on 1 sitting)  ;D

"Then Isabella Anderson and Francis Anderson marry in December 1859. Francis is widowed and is aged 68 whilst Isabella is aged 33! Address of Francis is given as 28 Gellymill Street and Isabella's is given as 38 Gellymill Street. I suspect this to be lies and they were actually living together, but who knows"

The marriage was post Statutory Records i.e. what info. is on there including witnesses?

Have you followed back the parentage of each for a common ancestor as relationships as close as cousins could marry i.e. not 'incest' but going back you may find the possible/probable connection?

This was common for people of same surnames marrying in local areas as everyone was more or less related i.e. no surprise although the age difference does pose some curiosity although at this point I don't think (I) would be assuming anything untoward without having investigated further back given the times & lack of potential wives/husbands in communities in the era/area?

Annie
South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, Cumming, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"

Offline Liviani

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Re: Isabella Anderson of Gamrie. A very complicated lady!
« Reply #5 on: Monday 25 June 18 03:12 BST (UK) »
My next question (as said prior, too much to take in on 1 sitting)  ;D

"Then Isabella Anderson and Francis Anderson marry in December 1859. Francis is widowed and is aged 68 whilst Isabella is aged 33! Address of Francis is given as 28 Gellymill Street and Isabella's is given as 38 Gellymill Street. I suspect this to be lies and they were actually living together, but who knows"

The marriage was post Statutory Records i.e. what info. is on there including witnesses?

Have you followed back the parentage of each for a common ancestor as relationships as close as cousins could marry i.e. not 'incest' but going back you may find the possible/probable connection?

This was common for people of same surnames marrying in local areas as everyone was more or less related i.e. no surprise although the age difference does pose some curiosity although at this point I don't think (I) would be assuming anything untoward without having investigated further back given the times & lack of potential wives/husbands in communities in the era/area?

Annie

The witnesses to their marriage in 1859 were a Thomas Wilson and George Gill. These men were also witnesses to Isabella Anderson signing her mark.

They were married under the forms of of the Established Church, married by James Cruden, Minister.

Francis occupation is 'formerly a farmer'. Isabella doesn't have an occupation listed.
Francis parents are named as; William Anderson, Farmer & Christian Bruce, both deceased. Isabellas are named as Robert Anderson, Farmer & Elizabeth Ferrier, both deceased.

I cannot seem to get anywhere with the Andersons other than both Francis and Isabella's parents due to the era involved.

Francis did have a brother named Robert born 1802. So on the off chance this is the Robert that's Isabella's father that would make Francis, Isabella's uncle.  :o
It is theoretically possible, as Robert Anderson and Elizabeth Ferrier married in 1825, making the ages fit ok.

The problem is that Anderson has such heavy concentrations in this area of Scotland.

mtDNA subclade K1b2b. Father's Y-DNA I-S25383
GEDmatch kit; CF7867455
Father's kit; RY1336515
Mother's kit; AF2312865


Kincardineshire
Sheret, Hosie, Valentine, Crow, Beattie, McArthur, Wyllie.
Angus (Forfarshire)
Adam, Valentine, Ewan, Elder, Guild, Kydd, Bradford, Stronner, Gibson, Cloudsley, Evans, Stewart, Stott.
Perthshire
Small, Robertson, Murray, Kennedy, McGregor
Ross & Cromarty
Cameron, Stewart, Grant
Banffshire - Gamrie
Anderson, Massie

Offline Liviani

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Re: Isabella Anderson of Gamrie. A very complicated lady!
« Reply #6 on: Monday 25 June 18 03:34 BST (UK) »
Other children of Robert Anderson and Elizabeth Ferrier (siblings of my Isabella Anderson).

John. 1828
Francis. 1830 (there's that name again!)
James. 1832
Elizabeth. 1832
Barbara. 1836

all born Gamrie.

mtDNA subclade K1b2b. Father's Y-DNA I-S25383
GEDmatch kit; CF7867455
Father's kit; RY1336515
Mother's kit; AF2312865


Kincardineshire
Sheret, Hosie, Valentine, Crow, Beattie, McArthur, Wyllie.
Angus (Forfarshire)
Adam, Valentine, Ewan, Elder, Guild, Kydd, Bradford, Stronner, Gibson, Cloudsley, Evans, Stewart, Stott.
Perthshire
Small, Robertson, Murray, Kennedy, McGregor
Ross & Cromarty
Cameron, Stewart, Grant
Banffshire - Gamrie
Anderson, Massie

Offline Rosinish

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Re: Isabella Anderson of Gamrie. A very complicated lady!
« Reply #7 on: Monday 25 June 18 04:05 BST (UK) »
As always a Timeline with names/dates/places etc. is a good thing for all to see/follow without having to keep scrolling etc. & keeps everything in order when things become complicated.

Names of all children in order are a good pointer but have you checked out the siblings of each (Francis & Isabella), witnesses to events etc. which can hold good clues?

Annie

South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, Cumming, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Isabella Anderson of Gamrie. A very complicated lady!
« Reply #8 on: Monday 25 June 18 07:57 BST (UK) »
Isabella is the daughter in law of the head here (though it is actually her step-father).
Daughter-in-law often is used where we would say stepdaughter, and likewise son-in-law for stepson. Nothing unusual in that.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.